Creating Cohorts - Ted Leavenworth and Tommy Cota

[00:00:01] Hey everyone, Brian Kelly here. Welcome to another episode of the Cultivate Church Planting Podcast.

[00:00:06] I hope you've been enjoying the show and I want to tell you about an opportunity to support church planting and church planters.

[00:00:13] Go to cgn.org, click on donate, you'll see a drop down for church planting. I'm going to put the link in the show notes.

[00:00:20] But this is a great way to practically support the work of the ministry, support church planting, support church planters.

[00:00:29] We're going to see that all those funds go right out onto the field.

[00:00:31] So I just wanted to tell you about that opportunity and now let's get into the episode.

[00:00:38] All right, welcome to the Cultivate Church Planting Podcast and we're back again with another episode.

[00:00:43] And we have my good friends Ted and Tommy here to talk about cohorts.

[00:00:52] And let me just say this right off the bat before you guys get started and kind of introduce yourselves.

[00:00:57] And you've both been on the show before and both are part of the CGN executive team along with myself.

[00:01:06] And right off the bat, the word cohort has kind of become a popular kind of word lately.

[00:01:16] So maybe Ted, you could get started right away by telling us exactly what we mean when we say cohort.

[00:01:22] Right. In our context, what we're talking about is a small gathering of pastors gathering together for a dedicated period of time for the express purpose of being able to both pour out and to have others pour into us.

[00:01:43] And gathering of time to strengthen each other, to bandage one another's wounds, get ministry to encourage one another.

[00:01:53] Yeah.

[00:01:54] The Bible says don't grow weary in doing good for in due season you'll reap if you don't lose heart.

[00:01:59] And all Satan has to do is get you to quit.

[00:02:02] And for so many of us, you know, that's Monday morning, right?

[00:02:06] Right.

[00:02:06] Every Monday.

[00:02:07] Every Monday morning, yeah.

[00:02:09] He's like, I'll quit this Monday.

[00:02:10] All I got to do is get you to quit.

[00:02:12] So cohorts is, hey, we're going to gather together for the purpose of encouraging one another, spurring one another on towards love and good deeds.

[00:02:20] And having a focused time of refreshing so that we don't grow weary in doing good.

[00:02:28] Great.

[00:02:29] Yeah.

[00:02:29] And I asked these guys to be on the show today because I'm really, really impressed, especially, Ted, with you.

[00:02:37] You've been doing these.

[00:02:38] Rob Salvato is another pastor that's very good at this.

[00:02:42] And full disclosure, I ripped off the idea from Rob.

[00:02:45] Oh, you did?

[00:02:45] Okay.

[00:02:45] Who ripped it off from somebody else.

[00:02:46] Somebody else, yeah.

[00:02:47] Yeah, but maybe you could say you perfected it.

[00:02:51] I doubt I could do that.

[00:02:53] But I'm just, in hearing about what these guys are doing, just really impressed with it.

[00:02:57] And then, Tommy, you've been a part of one of these.

[00:03:01] So why don't you talk about that?

[00:03:02] Yeah, I've been a part of it with Rob.

[00:03:03] And I think it was the first one, too, if I'm not mistaken.

[00:03:06] He called me up a couple years ago and just asked me to consider being a part of a cohort.

[00:03:12] And the whole thing with a cohort being kind of a buzzword or thing.

[00:03:17] And I was like, okay.

[00:03:18] And I was like, what in the world is a cohort?

[00:03:21] I don't even know what a cohort is.

[00:03:25] But exactly like what Ted said, it's just a great opportunity.

[00:03:28] I really enjoyed it.

[00:03:29] It was just a year-long commitment.

[00:03:33] And throughout that year, there was about four times that we gathered for close to a week, about four days.

[00:03:39] And it was exactly that, the time to just sit, pour into others.

[00:03:45] But in the small group, have others pour into ourselves.

[00:03:50] And it was a really cool thing, too, because the very first, our first gathering, man, it was so anointed and blessed.

[00:03:57] You know, there was something comfortable to be vulnerable, you know.

[00:04:03] And one of the takeaways, I would say, for myself, and I would even say perhaps even for the other guys, man, it was that the friendship that was developed, you know, the bond of brotherhood with these group of men.

[00:04:19] And like even still to this day, we, you know, that season is done with that cohort.

[00:04:23] But still to this day, man, we're constantly calling and connecting with one another.

[00:04:28] Keeping in touch and stuff.

[00:04:29] Keeping in touch.

[00:04:30] We have a group text.

[00:04:31] And, you know, we'll just, you know, whether it's a prayer request or even if it's something funny, like a meme or something like that.

[00:04:37] You know, hey, check this out.

[00:04:39] We start clowning and stuff.

[00:04:40] But, yeah, the friendships.

[00:04:43] And also, too, I think when I agreed to be a part of this cohort with Rob, I think there was one guy that I really had and I knew, didn't have a good, solid relationship with him, but I knew him.

[00:04:58] And, but by, after that first cohort, that first gathering, it was like with all five of these guys, all six of these guys, I think it was, man, it was like we're brothers, you know, we're gonna be like brothers for life now.

[00:05:10] Yeah, there's something that happens in those small groups that can't happen in like a Sunday morning or even like a men's Bible study.

[00:05:16] Like you get together, you're staying at the same place because you would all stay at the same place, right?

[00:05:21] Yeah, yeah.

[00:05:21] We all stay, you know, Rob would, you know, it was really cool, too.

[00:05:24] It's just like the whole, how Rob kind of designed it and everything.

[00:05:28] And it was...

[00:05:29] And Ted perfected.

[00:05:33] Perhaps, you know, but it was just so awesome because it just gave this room for the Holy Spirit, God to work, you know, and there was really no major agenda other than, hey, let's talk about ministry.

[00:05:46] Let's talk about our lives, you know, our marriages and our walks and, you know, our walk with the Lord and all that stuff.

[00:05:51] And so...

[00:05:52] And then supernaturally where the Holy Spirit takes that conversation.

[00:05:55] Yeah.

[00:05:56] And how there's just a divine appointment.

[00:05:59] And themes kind of tend to rise up, don't they?

[00:06:02] Yeah, yeah.

[00:06:02] You know, where there's just some central theme of what the work, what God each time away is like, okay, this is our theme for this week.

[00:06:11] Yeah, yeah.

[00:06:12] And going into it, kind of not knowing if there was going to be a theme, but, you know, immediately you realize like, oh, this is what the Lord's doing with us right now.

[00:06:19] Yeah.

[00:06:20] You know, so...

[00:06:20] I love when that kind of stuff happens.

[00:06:21] Yeah, yeah.

[00:06:22] It was really awesome.

[00:06:24] Love it.

[00:06:25] And I would encourage anybody, man, having an opportunity to be a part of a cohort to do it.

[00:06:31] Okay.

[00:06:32] And to be a part of it, but also to create this.

[00:06:36] Right.

[00:06:36] Because I think more pastors need...

[00:06:37] So, Ted, going to you, you've planted churches.

[00:06:41] You've sent out a lot of guys to plant churches.

[00:06:44] Like, you're very heavily involved in church planting.

[00:06:46] Yeah.

[00:06:46] And a lot of your guys, your younger guys, those are the ones that you're putting into the cohort.

[00:06:51] Yeah, it's a both and kind of thing.

[00:06:53] So the way that we've structured it is that the church, my church, Reliance Church in Temecula, underwrites these cohorts.

[00:07:05] So what the church does is we provide the venue for the gathering and we provide the food for the gathering.

[00:07:14] So, you know, we'll set it up and then logistically we'll make a Costco run and, you know, fill up a couple of baskets with food and, you know, we just get back together.

[00:07:24] So that's what the church provides.

[00:07:27] And then we tell all the participants, look, all you got to do is get there.

[00:07:31] Okay.

[00:07:31] So their airfare or their car or whatever.

[00:07:33] Yeah, you get there, we'll take care of everything else.

[00:07:36] And so that's logistically the kind of the setup.

[00:07:39] And then it can be males individually, just the guys get together, or it can be couples.

[00:07:50] And what I do with the guys that I've sent out, and it's just the way that it's worked out.

[00:07:58] Most of these guys in the cohort, one of the cohorts that I'm currently doing is guys that have been in ministry.

[00:08:06] They've been in the midst of their church plant for somewhere between one and three years.

[00:08:10] Oh, so they're fresh in.

[00:08:11] Yeah.

[00:08:12] And so we structured that one to say this is going to be husbands and wives, which necessitates a really big place and logistically has some problems.

[00:08:22] But we've overcome those.

[00:08:24] Do you do like Airbnbs and stuff?

[00:08:25] We do.

[00:08:26] And we have them bring their kids too.

[00:08:28] Oh, wow.

[00:08:29] Yeah, because you can't just leave the kids.

[00:08:30] Right.

[00:08:31] It's the whole family.

[00:08:32] And so there's a whole dynamic of ministry that's taking place with the kids.

[00:08:35] And they're over the time, they're like cousins, long lost cousins.

[00:08:41] It's almost like a family reunion type situation.

[00:08:43] It is.

[00:08:43] And they're loving it.

[00:08:45] They look forward to it.

[00:08:48] And for a church planning family, this is like a lifeline for everybody where they come and they're enjoying this time together.

[00:08:56] The wives are all connecting and being able to share.

[00:08:59] Because they have a camaraderie.

[00:09:00] They're going through the same thing.

[00:09:01] Exactly.

[00:09:01] Their husbands are dealing with the same things.

[00:09:03] Right.

[00:09:03] It's really cool.

[00:09:04] And so that's kind of the theme for that cohort.

[00:09:07] Now, and we've structured that one pretty much in a mirror image of what Rob was doing with Tommy's cohort.

[00:09:15] Tommy's cohort was all the guys.

[00:09:17] And then it was like, okay, hey, we're going to aim for our concluding one to be, hey, bring all your wives and come together.

[00:09:27] I did the opposite of that.

[00:09:29] So it's all husbands, wives, kids all together for that particular cohort.

[00:09:35] And then we will conclude the cohort with just the guys getting together.

[00:09:41] And probably we'll do simultaneously.

[00:09:43] We'll do just the guys, just the women so they can get, so they can each have their own time away.

[00:09:49] And then I have a couple of other cohorts that I'm doing internationally.

[00:09:53] And those cohorts both are just the guys.

[00:09:56] And that's more of a logistical thing.

[00:09:59] And so we're doing one in Spain that's in process.

[00:10:04] We're about to start one in Ireland, which is going to be a new cohort.

[00:10:09] But that's kind of the theme and the idea there.

[00:10:12] That's cool.

[00:10:13] And from the way you were explaining it before the episode, it's like a year-long thing.

[00:10:19] So you and the cohort, if you're being invited into this, would commit to a year.

[00:10:25] But you only meet four times, three times, two?

[00:10:30] And again, everyone's a little bit different.

[00:10:31] So the structure of Tommy's was that.

[00:10:34] The structure of the one that I'm doing with the guys that I've sent out, that one's longer than a year.

[00:10:40] Because we're bringing the whole family, every four months doesn't work.

[00:10:45] It's just too much.

[00:10:46] And so the way that one works out is pretty much more like eight months apart or so.

[00:10:55] And so that spans longer than a year.

[00:10:58] And so all in all, that probably will stretch out to over two years for that one cohort.

[00:11:03] Because you can do it for as long as you want it to.

[00:11:04] You absolutely can.

[00:11:05] But then the limiter is, then you just can't do other, like you've got the next generation coming in.

[00:11:09] So you want to make sure to leave room for them.

[00:11:11] Well, and we're encouraging the guys that have been through the cohort, as you said, now it's time for you to go do a cohort.

[00:11:18] Yeah.

[00:11:19] Okay, let's talk about that.

[00:11:20] Because, you know, I'm listening to this.

[00:11:24] I've already heard you guys explain this.

[00:11:25] I know what's been going on.

[00:11:26] But it's kind of getting me excited and thinking, like, how can we do this?

[00:11:30] And so why don't you walk through what it would take?

[00:11:33] And mindful of the fact that a lot of our listeners are maybe church plants.

[00:11:38] A lot of them are also churches that are planting churches like yours, Pastor Ted.

[00:11:42] But why don't you walk through what it would take to do something like this?

[00:11:46] Maybe, Tommy, you can hit that.

[00:11:46] Yeah, I'll start.

[00:11:47] You know, so kind of the same thing.

[00:11:48] Rob was encouraged us.

[00:11:50] Hey, you guys, you know, now do the same with a group of guys, you know, in your area or even within your church.

[00:11:58] And so what I have done, I haven't really made a full-on commitment like, hey, we're going to do this cohort, but have talked about it, discussed it.

[00:12:08] And because there's a couple of guys in our community that I've been fellowshipping with that are pastors.

[00:12:14] And so what we do is once a month, we just we gather there locally because it's we all live in the same city.

[00:12:21] But the approach is in the heart is, hey, let's this is a time where we can just talk, pray, hang out, you guys, you know, not really be, you know, too organized in something, you know, but leave room for the Holy Spirit to work.

[00:12:33] And so it's kind of just, you know, it doesn't have to be let's get out of town for four days.

[00:12:40] Right, like a retreat.

[00:12:41] Yeah, you know, and to be honest, it's like, you know, for myself, you know, that encouragement is like, oh, man, I don't know if I don't have personally the capacity to do that, you know.

[00:12:51] Yeah, it's one thing for, you know, for a larger church to be able to have the means to do this.

[00:12:57] But for a smaller church with a little more humble, you know.

[00:13:01] Yeah.

[00:13:01] And the thing is that the heart is still there, though, you know, and the connections.

[00:13:05] And because I think that's the heart or the biggest thing, the big idea behind it for me was personally was the connection with the men, you know, and just talking ministry, you know, because.

[00:13:18] That's the heart of it.

[00:13:19] Yeah.

[00:13:20] And all the other stuff is, I laughed when you were talking about some of the smaller churches may not be able to do that.

[00:13:25] I was in Uganda one time and this church put on this conference there and they planned it all out, but they didn't have the funds to get the food because they promised everybody food.

[00:13:35] So it wasn't part of our group or anything.

[00:13:38] It was just one that I knew of in town.

[00:13:40] So everybody got there and they're like, it was like a three day thing.

[00:13:43] They're like, OK, this is going to be a time, a very spiritual time.

[00:13:46] It's going to be a time of prayer and fasting.

[00:13:49] The Lord is leading us to fast for three days.

[00:13:54] That's funny.

[00:13:55] That's how it works.

[00:13:57] That's how it works.

[00:13:58] We're going to be camping.

[00:14:00] Bring your tent.

[00:14:01] That's how it works, man.

[00:14:02] But one of the things, though, too, is I think in these cohorts and especially with peers and with other guys that are pastoring, we don't always have that outlet to share the things that are really burdening us or that we're challenged with or that we're personally struggling in.

[00:14:21] And, you know, it's like that deeper level stuff.

[00:14:24] Yeah.

[00:14:25] So it gives that opportunity like, man, you know, I got to tell you, man, what I'm struggling with, you know, with whatever it might be, you know, and it's a safe place.

[00:14:34] And I think that was the one thing, too, I think, with the cohort was the establishment of this is a safe place.

[00:14:42] Right.

[00:14:43] You say that at the get-go.

[00:14:44] Yeah.

[00:14:44] Right from the gate is a safe place where you can be vulnerable.

[00:14:48] There's no judgment here.

[00:14:49] We're here to, as brothers, to cry with you, to pray with you, to pray for you and, you know, vice versa, you know.

[00:14:55] But that also takes some—sorry, Ted, but that probably also takes some planning on your part as to who you're inviting.

[00:15:01] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:15:01] What guys are going to be there?

[00:15:02] Yeah, you have to be really strategic about that.

[00:15:04] And by strategic, I mean you really have to pray and let the Lord put the cohort together.

[00:15:13] And, you know, the one that—one of the ones that I'm currently doing, the guys that I've sent out, they're not all guys that I've sent out.

[00:15:21] There's another guy in there who we just supported in their early planting efforts.

[00:15:27] It got on our radar.

[00:15:28] I'm like, hey, we want to get behind that.

[00:15:32] But, hey, I wanted to include him.

[00:15:34] And as I prayed, and then it dawned on me, well, all of these guys are in their first three years of church planting.

[00:15:40] I didn't consciously think about it.

[00:15:41] So it was almost like the Lord put it together.

[00:15:43] The Lord totally put it together.

[00:15:44] So anyway, I think you think about that and you pray about it.

[00:15:48] And then the Lord lays guys on your hearts.

[00:15:50] And it can't be too big and it can't be too small.

[00:15:54] What's the right size, would you say?

[00:15:57] Personally, I think it should be ideally about four or five guys.

[00:16:00] Really?

[00:16:01] Oh, that's small.

[00:16:01] It can be a little—I'm talking about, yeah.

[00:16:03] I mean, I think, Tommy, for your cohort—

[00:16:05] We had six.

[00:16:06] Was that counting, Rob, though?

[00:16:08] No, with Rob, it was seven.

[00:16:09] Seven, which, okay, I would say that's probably the outer limit.

[00:16:13] Because otherwise, you know, I think logistically it's just too hard to pull off.

[00:16:19] Yeah, I didn't think about that because your lodging, food, everything is—

[00:16:23] Exactly.

[00:16:24] But, you know, there are ways you could get creative.

[00:16:27] Like, for instance, for a church that is a little more austere, less money available,

[00:16:33] it could be a camping trip.

[00:16:35] You know what I mean?

[00:16:36] Yeah.

[00:16:36] And it would be more difficult to do that with the wives and the kids.

[00:16:42] The families, yeah.

[00:16:42] But you could do a camping trip.

[00:16:44] And the thing—what's that old saying?

[00:16:47] I mean, it's women don't need a reason to get together.

[00:16:50] They just need a place, but guys need a reason.

[00:16:52] And pastors, when we get together, let's be honest, we have a tendency to, you know,

[00:16:59] puff out our chests and kind of talk about, you know, all my ministries or all that.

[00:17:05] Yeah, it's like that superficial kind of stuff.

[00:17:07] That's the opposite of what we're going for.

[00:17:09] And it's interesting because you think about—I was thinking about this, the difference between,

[00:17:13] you know, the different gatherings that we do.

[00:17:15] We do conferences.

[00:17:16] You know, that's a big—kind of a big scale.

[00:17:18] And then you have retreats.

[00:17:20] And that can be, you know, a women's retreat or men's retreat.

[00:17:22] It's still kind of a bigger group.

[00:17:23] But this is something where you're—it's unavoidable that you're going to be talking

[00:17:28] about real deal life issues.

[00:17:30] Yeah.

[00:17:31] Well, and we spend our lives as pastors pouring into other people.

[00:17:35] Yeah.

[00:17:35] And, you know, Chuck used to always tell us, you can't give what you ain't got.

[00:17:41] You know, he says, it's like the measles.

[00:17:43] You can't give them unless you got them.

[00:17:46] And so we need times of refreshing, and we need times where we need to be filled.

[00:17:52] And I think that's the strategic thing, which actually leads me to another aspect of it,

[00:17:57] something Rob was always careful to do, and I've tried to do with my guys.

[00:18:00] Is I will bring someone to—as a guest to join the cohort.

[00:18:08] Okay.

[00:18:08] For the whole time?

[00:18:09] No.

[00:18:10] Okay.

[00:18:10] Well, for Rob, I think he did.

[00:18:13] Yeah, yeah.

[00:18:14] And I thought that was really good, looking back on that.

[00:18:17] Right.

[00:18:17] Because, like, you know, the very first one was, you know, when we got together, you know,

[00:18:23] the whole idea was like, hey, we're going to talk about leadership, you know.

[00:18:26] And Rob had brought someone in.

[00:18:29] And the someone that we bring as a guest is obviously someone who may be a subject matter

[00:18:34] expert or somebody who's coming to pour in.

[00:18:37] Yeah.

[00:18:37] He's going to pour out.

[00:18:39] Right.

[00:18:39] And you guys are going to receive that.

[00:18:41] Right.

[00:18:41] Yeah.

[00:18:41] And so Ed Taylor had come, and man, it was just really good because, you know, I remember

[00:18:47] that first night, it's like, okay, there was—we all had questions in regards to, okay,

[00:18:51] leadership, you know, organizational things, you know, how to build a team.

[00:18:55] Here's some things.

[00:18:56] Here's some thoughts.

[00:18:57] And so we're all throwing out these thoughts or some of the things that we've done or some

[00:19:01] of the things that we haven't done should we do.

[00:19:04] And so too—

[00:19:05] And he's been there before, so he's able to kind of walk you through that.

[00:19:07] Yeah, Ed's been there.

[00:19:08] Also with Rob.

[00:19:09] Rob, you know, also had a lot to pour into us as well.

[00:19:12] But it was just a lot of—just throwing a lot of things there at the wall.

[00:19:17] And each time you guys got together, each quarterly gathering was a new guest.

[00:19:23] And so like for me, it was the same.

[00:19:26] I brought in—I had church planters.

[00:19:28] And so I brought in a subject matter expert.

[00:19:30] I brought in a guy who himself has planted many church and sent out many people to plant.

[00:19:36] And certainly that is my background, but I wanted them to hear from a different voice.

[00:19:41] Yeah, yeah.

[00:19:41] And so I—

[00:19:42] That's important.

[00:19:43] So, you know, in my case, I brought in Jason Duff and had him, you know, share some of his—and

[00:19:48] his wife joined as well.

[00:19:50] And so they were able to pour into the guys.

[00:19:53] And then at another time, I brought in a missionary couple who had church planted internationally

[00:20:00] and they came in to pour into them.

[00:20:02] And so it provides a little variety so they're not hearing the same—

[00:20:07] The same person.

[00:20:08] Yes, exactly.

[00:20:09] Yeah.

[00:20:09] Yeah.

[00:20:10] It was really good.

[00:20:11] Do you—so how would it—how would they—would you do a weekend?

[00:20:15] Would you do during the week?

[00:20:16] I mean, you're thinking about logistics and job schedules.

[00:20:18] And how far in advance would you kind of plan these out?

[00:20:21] I think some of that.

[00:20:23] Yours were during the week, right?

[00:20:24] Yeah, it was during the week.

[00:20:26] And again, Rob, when he asked, you know, it was—I think he asked me, it was probably

[00:20:32] like in August and it wasn't going to—something to pray about, consider—

[00:20:35] Why did he ask you?

[00:20:39] So I—I know, I was like, why me, right?

[00:20:40] No, I'm just curious.

[00:20:41] I needed it, bro.

[00:20:41] How do you pick these guys?

[00:20:42] Because he owes them money.

[00:20:44] He saw that I needed it.

[00:20:46] You know, this poor guy.

[00:20:48] Yeah, and I think it was just, you know, obviously having a relationship, but kind of like what

[00:20:53] you said, Ted, it was guys that have been in ministry, maybe not for a long time, you

[00:20:59] know, but for like within 10 years or something like that.

[00:21:02] That was Rob's criteria for your group.

[00:21:04] Yeah, yeah.

[00:21:05] Okay.

[00:21:05] So you had the initial criteria that you wanted to match, and then through your relational

[00:21:10] database, he kind of went through and prayed through.

[00:21:13] Yeah, yeah.

[00:21:13] And so he kind of laid it out, sent me an email, you know, and laid out the idea and

[00:21:19] kind of like a format, you know, and how long it would be.

[00:21:22] And so, yeah, there was enough time in advance for me to plan.

[00:21:27] So I think it was something like in late August, he kind of—or September, perhaps, he, hey,

[00:21:32] pray about this.

[00:21:33] And it wasn't—didn't start until like that next year, March or something like that,

[00:21:38] of that next year.

[00:21:39] Oh, so you had plenty of time.

[00:21:40] Yeah, plenty of time to—

[00:21:41] To get time off work if you had to.

[00:21:42] I mean, you're full-time as a pastor, but—

[00:21:44] Yeah, yeah.

[00:21:45] Yeah, and so you set your goal for your first one, you know, send out the invitations.

[00:21:50] And then once that first one's established, what we tend to do is one of the last things

[00:21:56] before we depart is we agree on, okay, what's our next date going to be?

[00:22:01] Oh, okay.

[00:22:02] And so that becomes helpful.

[00:22:04] Now, up front, if you say, hey, we're going to do this quarterly, well, then you've

[00:22:08] got your template.

[00:22:09] You kind of know what it is, yeah.

[00:22:09] But everybody's got to agree on their date.

[00:22:11] We all pencil it out, and then it goes from there.

[00:22:15] Do you say something like, this is a non-negotiable.

[00:22:17] If you want to be part of this cohort, you need to be part of all the dates or the activities?

[00:22:22] Or do some guys are unable to make it, or how does that work?

[00:22:25] Well, I mean, with the group that I have, they're all church planters.

[00:22:29] And so as an example, one of the couples was the newest in the church planting process and

[00:22:40] is a tent maker.

[00:22:41] So he had to go out and get a job.

[00:22:43] And so sadly, he missed our last cohort because he had a job.

[00:22:48] He had to be there.

[00:22:49] Good job, yeah.

[00:22:50] So I made special arrangements to go and visit my wife and myself with he and his wife to

[00:22:58] have something rather than nothing.

[00:22:59] They missed out on the whole thing, which is unfortunate.

[00:23:01] But we were able to sort of make that up.

[00:23:04] Yeah, you're going to be flexible for that kind of thing.

[00:23:07] Right.

[00:23:07] Especially with church planters.

[00:23:08] You want to help them out and get them going.

[00:23:11] Yeah.

[00:23:11] What's your next?

[00:23:12] Are you, so now you're doing a thing locally.

[00:23:15] Are you going on to be on any more cohorts or do you kind of?

[00:23:19] For me personally, do you graduate?

[00:23:21] Man, you know, I don't know.

[00:23:24] But to be honest with you, I'd love to go on to be a part of another cohort, you know, as

[00:23:29] a participant because it was just so rich.

[00:23:34] You know, it really was because, you know, I think just as pastors in this role, you

[00:23:41] know, there's a need for having an opportunity to, you know, just to release the valve, you

[00:23:51] know, because there's a lot that is held in.

[00:23:53] And, you know, just having this conversation right now, man, I'm going back in my little

[00:23:58] mind palace and just remembering those emotions and the refreshing.

[00:24:02] I was like, man, I'm so glad.

[00:24:03] Did you cry?

[00:24:03] Yeah.

[00:24:05] We cried, we laughed, man.

[00:24:07] We did it all.

[00:24:08] I bet, yeah.

[00:24:08] Yeah.

[00:24:09] It was really good.

[00:24:10] And, you know, so, and I think that was, you know, that was one of the special things

[00:24:15] behind it, you know, is that it, for me, it felt as not just personally, but for my

[00:24:23] marriage, like it was a boost, you know, for my marriage and also for ministry, you know,

[00:24:29] how it benefits, I feel, you know, and it benefited the ministry.

[00:24:33] Yeah.

[00:24:34] Yeah.

[00:24:34] God's people and, you know, just very refreshing and, you know, and all that stuff.

[00:24:39] So yeah, I would really recommend it to anybody, man, go for it.

[00:24:43] I think there are a lot of ways you can be creative about accomplishing it.

[00:24:46] Okay.

[00:24:46] And so if you have it on your heart that you want to facilitate cohorts, then I would say

[00:24:52] pray about who you would invite.

[00:24:53] Right.

[00:24:53] Pray about who you would invite to serve as mentors and come to poor in.

[00:24:59] Speaker kind of.

[00:24:59] Precisely.

[00:25:00] For lack of a better term.

[00:25:01] Yeah.

[00:25:02] And then, you know, you consider budget and then you plan accordingly.

[00:25:06] If you have to, okay, we can't afford an Airbnb, then all right, figure out an alternative.

[00:25:13] And we all know people of different, you know, means.

[00:25:18] And so you don't know who is in your church that might have a vacation place or rental place

[00:25:24] that they can make available.

[00:25:25] Do you think that would be something that you could present to the church and say,

[00:25:27] Hey, I've got some guys here that we really think are the Lord's, you know, wants to do

[00:25:32] something great.

[00:25:32] And would anybody be interested?

[00:25:35] You think about, I mean, I share with our church what we're doing.

[00:25:40] I take a few pictures.

[00:25:41] Sometimes I'll ask the pastors to send a video, a testimony, just, Hey, this is, you know,

[00:25:46] Pastor Olson, thank you so much for pouring into us and investing in it.

[00:25:50] Because your church is investing in it.

[00:25:52] Right.

[00:25:52] It's an missional endeavor.

[00:25:55] Yeah.

[00:25:55] And so, you know, we take, you know, you guys do too.

[00:25:59] You take a missions team, you know, for, you know, for example, you go to,

[00:26:02] to the Philippines and you do a pastor's conference and you're telling your people,

[00:26:06] Hey, we're going there to pour into and equip these pastors.

[00:26:09] It's no different than that.

[00:26:10] Yeah.

[00:26:10] You know?

[00:26:11] So.

[00:26:11] It's a good point.

[00:26:12] Yeah.

[00:26:13] So it seems like even with smaller churches, you know, we all need to have a missions budget.

[00:26:18] We all need to have our mind on, you know, church planting.

[00:26:21] Not everybody's going to be the same, like as the next, but to have that be part of your

[00:26:27] strategy as a church to kind of lay it, lay the foundation of, Hey, we're going to do

[00:26:32] missions.

[00:26:33] We're going to do church planting.

[00:26:34] We're also going to be doing some cohorts.

[00:26:37] Yeah.

[00:26:37] Yeah.

[00:26:37] That's a really good idea.

[00:26:39] You can ask your people to give specifically to it.

[00:26:41] If you're so inclined, we don't, but, or you could just dedicate part of your missions

[00:26:46] budget towards that.

[00:26:48] You could strategically approach other churches.

[00:26:52] We're, we're all friends together.

[00:26:54] And, you know, we might say, you know, I pick up the phone, call another pastor friend

[00:26:59] of mine and say, Hey, let me tell you what I'm doing.

[00:27:01] And, you know, would your church be willing to invest in this as a missional investment?

[00:27:06] Yeah.

[00:27:07] And, and so they might be inclined to do that.

[00:27:09] Or as is, was the case with Rob and I, I mean, we spend a lot of time together and he

[00:27:14] was just sharing, Oh, let me tell you what God's doing.

[00:27:16] I'm like, I am stealing that.

[00:27:17] You caught it.

[00:27:18] Yeah.

[00:27:18] I'm doing that.

[00:27:19] And that's a great, let me just give a little plug for being part of a network like CGN.

[00:27:23] And, you know, it's people are often like, I can do this by myself.

[00:27:27] I'm just my own church.

[00:27:28] God's called us.

[00:27:29] But to have a network of churches, like, so I'm in Florida, you could call me up, you

[00:27:34] know, email me and be like, Hey, we got this idea to do a cohort.

[00:27:39] It's going to be seven guys total.

[00:27:41] You know, we're all from around the country, but do you have any place around in Florida

[00:27:46] that we could meet like a house or something like that?

[00:27:49] Right.

[00:27:49] Because I, right off the top of my head, I know of like two or three places that you could

[00:27:52] meet for free.

[00:27:53] Like you could use it as ministry.

[00:27:55] It's for me.

[00:27:55] For free.

[00:27:56] It's good.

[00:27:57] You heard it here first, folks.

[00:28:00] I put my phone number in the show notes.

[00:28:03] There you go.

[00:28:04] If you're doing a cohort, seriously, though, that's the thing.

[00:28:07] It's like, hit us up.

[00:28:08] Yeah.

[00:28:09] Because, you know, because your guys are coming from all over the place.

[00:28:12] Yeah.

[00:28:12] They're not just in one.

[00:28:13] Yeah.

[00:28:13] And that's another dynamic.

[00:28:15] I just thought, okay, I've got a guy coming from Kansas, Leavenworth, Kansas.

[00:28:19] As a matter of fact, I really like the name of that down.

[00:28:22] And we have somebody out in Murfreesboro, Tennessee.

[00:28:26] We've got someone in Knoxville, Tennessee.

[00:28:28] Yeah.

[00:28:28] And so on.

[00:28:29] And so we just share the love.

[00:28:31] And we got a guy in that cohort from McKinney, Texas.

[00:28:35] So we did our first one in McKinney, Texas.

[00:28:38] Okay.

[00:28:38] And so it was like, hey, let's do our next one.

[00:28:40] You know, they all wanted to come to Southern California for the next one.

[00:28:43] So, all right, let's come to Temecula.

[00:28:45] We'll do our next one here.

[00:28:46] Yeah.

[00:28:47] And then we went to Leavenworth.

[00:28:48] So you can go to the different places where the guys are from.

[00:28:50] Sure, you can move it around.

[00:28:51] And I tried to, in that instance, all the places I've mentioned, they're kind of central

[00:28:54] U.S.

[00:28:55] And so, okay, let's just share the love.

[00:28:58] Let's keep it in the central U.S., which, by the way, I mean, for these guys, they're

[00:29:02] making their way there.

[00:29:03] If I can keep it fairly close to home.

[00:29:06] That's better for them.

[00:29:07] Right.

[00:29:07] They can throw their family in the car and take a two or three hour road trip as opposed

[00:29:11] to airplane tickets for everybody.

[00:29:14] Especially for a family.

[00:29:15] Yeah.

[00:29:16] Yeah.

[00:29:17] Yeah.

[00:29:17] That's good stuff.

[00:29:19] I think, man, this is a good episode, a good strategy.

[00:29:24] What, I mean, kind of in closing this thing out, what would you say were the most valuable?

[00:29:29] I mean, you talked about it a little bit.

[00:29:30] Some of the most, like if you had to not talk someone into it, but just kind of say, this

[00:29:34] is really something you guys should be doing.

[00:29:36] What would you say, Tony?

[00:29:37] You know, I would say just for, as a pastor, you know, you need, we need the space, we need

[00:29:45] the time, and we need that, the like-mindedness to where we can be vulnerable.

[00:29:52] Because, you know, again, I think when pastors have the tendency to come together at a conference

[00:29:58] or something, it's, you know, the question is, hey, how's the church?

[00:30:01] Church is great, bro.

[00:30:02] It's growing.

[00:30:03] What ministry are you doing?

[00:30:04] Yeah.

[00:30:05] We're doing all these things.

[00:30:06] But, you know, in reality, you know, and this is, you know, the reality is, man, it's hard.

[00:30:11] You know, it is hard.

[00:30:13] You know, not everybody understands what, like what a pastor goes through and what a pastor,

[00:30:18] you know, the weight.

[00:30:20] Yeah.

[00:30:20] You know?

[00:30:21] But other pastors do.

[00:30:22] Other pastors do.

[00:30:23] I get it.

[00:30:24] And even when, so when you have that small group and the intention is, hey, we're going

[00:30:29] to be enriched, you know, in our ministry and our family.

[00:30:32] It's about our families, our marriages, and the work that God is doing in us.

[00:30:36] Yeah.

[00:30:36] You know?

[00:30:36] And it's like, okay, you know, I gotta, you know, so, you know, again, just going back

[00:30:41] to the conferences, or not the conferences, but our gatherings, our cohorts.

[00:30:45] The cohorts.

[00:30:45] You know, just the time of confession.

[00:30:49] Wow.

[00:30:49] You know?

[00:30:50] It was just sweet.

[00:30:51] So things get real.

[00:30:52] Things get real.

[00:30:54] I'm kind of scared to be part of one then.

[00:30:55] You know?

[00:30:56] But the thing is, like, you know, how often do, you know, do we as pastors, you know,

[00:31:01] from the pulpit preach this, you know, the healthiness of confession and everything.

[00:31:05] But, you know, and we understand that, but sometimes, like, we don't have that space or

[00:31:12] we always have the time to confess.

[00:31:14] But when you're there with like-minded brothers and there's a man that's standing next to you

[00:31:18] that's loving on you and it's not judging you and, you know, there to pray with you and to

[00:31:23] walk with you through that, you know, it is just amazing.

[00:31:26] And you don't know these guys at the, some of the guys you don't know.

[00:31:29] Yeah.

[00:31:29] At first.

[00:31:30] So you're not, it's not like you walk in the door.

[00:31:32] Hey, I'm Tommy.

[00:31:33] Let me tell you about everything that's going on.

[00:31:35] You get to know each other.

[00:31:36] Yeah.

[00:31:36] I remember it was like, man, okay, we, Rob got this wonderful, the very first one, this

[00:31:41] wonderful house that we're all at.

[00:31:42] We get there and, you know, and man, I was like, I got to go to the room, put my bag on

[00:31:47] the bed right there.

[00:31:49] Who's going to, someone's sleeping on the floor and it ain't me, you know?

[00:31:52] But then, you know, you meet these guys and you're like, oh, bro, hey, no, hey, we'll

[00:31:57] share, you know, you can have the bed.

[00:31:59] I'll sleep on the floor tomorrow, you know, and stuff.

[00:32:01] So, you know, that friendship really develops.

[00:32:05] Yeah.

[00:32:05] That, you know, two are better than one, right?

[00:32:08] Yeah.

[00:32:08] And we're exhorted to bear one another's burdens and thus fulfill the law of Christ.

[00:32:12] And there's just something, I mean, you get guys that are in the ministry and it gets

[00:32:20] real in a hurry and the walls come down.

[00:32:24] Yeah.

[00:32:25] You know, who said it?

[00:32:27] I mean, I hope one of you guys can fill it in, give the source.

[00:32:31] But it might be C.S.

[00:32:33] Lewis, but he said the definition of a true friend is that, you know, you get to talking

[00:32:38] and you say, I thought I was the only one.

[00:32:40] You know?

[00:32:41] Yeah, that's good.

[00:32:42] And I think that that's the magic of it.

[00:32:44] You're like, man, you're just like me.

[00:32:46] You've been there too.

[00:32:46] Yeah.

[00:32:47] Yeah, we've been there.

[00:32:47] And I think that was another thing too, is that realization is like, man, we're all

[00:32:51] going through something extremely similar, you know?

[00:32:55] Yeah.

[00:32:55] And then you come out at the other end after the year or whatever it is, the two years,

[00:32:59] and you really feel a benefit from it like no other thing.

[00:33:04] Well, and you have a source of people that you can rely on.

[00:33:07] Right.

[00:33:07] It doesn't end there.

[00:33:08] It's long term.

[00:33:08] You're, the available pool of people that you can reach out to grows.

[00:33:17] And it's like, oh man, I got seven new friends I can call.

[00:33:22] The mentor couple who comes or, you know, person that comes, you can say, oh man, can I get

[00:33:27] your phone number?

[00:33:28] Can I call you?

[00:33:28] Yeah.

[00:33:29] That's good.

[00:33:30] Yeah.

[00:33:30] It's good stuff, guys.

[00:33:31] Thanks so much for being on the show and sharing about this.

[00:33:34] And I hope this can kind of be a catalyst for a lot of guys out there to either be involved

[00:33:38] in the cohort, look for one.

[00:33:40] If you are out there and you're listening to the show, get on the CGN, Calvary Global

[00:33:45] Network website.

[00:33:45] There's a contact form and we're going to connect you with either these guys or some other guys

[00:33:50] that have done the cohorts and we'll work it out.

[00:33:52] We'll get it going.

[00:33:53] Amen.

[00:33:53] Yeah.

[00:33:54] Thanks guys.

[00:33:54] All right.

[00:33:55] Thanks, Brian.

[00:33:56] Thanks for listening.

[00:33:57] The Cultivate Church Planning Podcast is part of CGN Media, a podcast network that points

[00:34:02] to Christ.

[00:34:03] Check out cgnmedia.org for more great shows and ways to support the ministry.