151- Frontlines Ministry: Called As Light to the Darkness (with Jack Arnold)

[00:00:00] Welcome to Strength for Todays Pastor, Conversations with Current Senior Pastors and Leaders which will strengthen and help you in your pastoral ministry. And now, here's your host, Bill Holdridge of Pointing in Ministries. Welcome to podcast number 151 of Strength for Todays Pastor today

[00:00:27] where we're with Jack Arnold of Calvary Mount Sigh. This is the second part of our interview with Jack as we talked last time about Frontlines Ministry being the church. And now, we're going to be

[00:00:42] looking at what God has done and is doing in and through Calvary Mount Sigh, Frontlines Ministry, what He is doing through the church. So exciting to hear how God has allowed Jack and his team

[00:00:57] and the congregation to really invade the community with the gospel and with a love of Jesus, even though the community itself is typically and historically resistant to the gospel. So that's about it for introduction. Let's just dive right into our conversation with

[00:01:16] Pastor Jack Arnold. So Jack, welcome to the program really looking forward to this time together with you and good to see you, friend. Likewise, thanks for having me, Bill. I've been thinking a lot in last number of years about how much our parts of our culture are

[00:01:34] becoming a lot like the conditions in the first century. In the Roman Empire, you know, with the idolatry and with the aspects of atheism and then there are the religious movements and so on and so

[00:01:49] forth and like Paul and Athens, you know, they were very religious people, they acknowledged that you wanted to tell them about the God that they hadn't worship yet, the one who created everything.

[00:02:00] And that's all awesome. And then I've done a lot of thinking about what it meant for my wife and I to no longer live in California. We left California in 2015. We didn't leave it for any

[00:02:16] cultural religious, you know, political reason. We had something we were going to. Another version of another place for us to do what we do. But thinking about it in retrospect and even

[00:02:33] while we were still there, I was thinking, you know, the way this is going and the direction it's heading. The only way for a true believer to survive in a place like California is going to be

[00:02:48] that they see themselves as cross cultural missionaries and that that's their purpose in the culture. And if they can't see themselves as that, it's going to be really hard for them and the culture

[00:03:00] may swallow them up or they'll be discouraged or they'll go dark because they don't feel like they have a voice in the culture that they're part of. The culture left them, they didn't leave

[00:03:11] the culture left them and so they get silent to get quiet and they go dark like I said. And I think that that's true and even recently I've gotten involved a little bit with interaction with those that have left California believers and non-believers just asked them, you know,

[00:03:30] why was your experience and then I specifically asked Christians on these two Facebook groups that I was interested in. You know, what was your experience? Why did you leave and so on and so

[00:03:45] forth? And some, you know, they cited all of the kinds of reasons that you cited. Jack, it was just too much for them. They had families and I get that. I mean,

[00:03:55] you know, if they want to raise their children and they're not set up to homeschool or provide alternate education for their kids, that's just not who they are. They're not gifted in those

[00:04:04] areas. Then they want to go to a place like Tennessee or Texas or someplace where there is a conservative element and I totally get that. But for those that are called to stay willingly in a

[00:04:17] place like North Bend, good on them. You know? But if they're called to go somewhere else for the sake of family and for seeing the kingdom in a different way, in a different way, meaning different

[00:04:30] culturally than North Bend, good for them too. You know, so I'm not, I'm not speaking good or bad about a decision to leave. I'm just saying that those are decided to leave if they want to be

[00:04:40] authentic true followers of Christ. They better see themselves as cross-cultural missionaries in their own culture. And that's what you guys have done. You flip this thing on its ear. Instead of being overwhelmed by the culture and let the darkness keep the light from shining,

[00:05:00] you've said, the light is much more powerful than the darkness. Let's do light here. Then people are joining you in that and everybody's coming together. The link is strong relationship because you're constantly sharpening each other. You're constantly encouraging one another

[00:05:18] and you're on the same page. You have the same mission. In fact, you even, is this a name? You call it front line ministry. It's called front lines ministry. I mean, no, but you can.

[00:05:30] It's a great title. I mean, it is the front lines. You know? But it's the front lines not a battle in the sense of we're trying to conquer something in the flesh. The weapons of our warfare are

[00:05:42] not of the flesh. They're mighty through God with the pulling down of strongholds. We know that, but what you have emphasized and this is from your website and I thought it was very profound just

[00:05:53] looking at the home page of your website, love God, love others. And then a question and a little dialogue box under that who is Jesus? I mean, there it is. It's all about that. It's like

[00:06:08] loving God, loving others and then making Jesus central. He's the most important thing. That's right. And that makes the light actually eclipse the darkness. Yeah, there's a, there's been a appointed move towards simplicity and relationship.

[00:06:30] And one of the things that we did in California that became an absolute necessity up here in a game changer in that regard is, is a monthly fast prey and worship night. And so the first

[00:06:46] Sunday of the month, we get together and we ask the whole church to fast and to come for prayer. And it's one thing that you see that the early church, it's just all over the book of Acts.

[00:07:00] I mean, it is one of the main functions of the church and I would argue that it's one of the least performed functions of the modern American church. That they would actually fast and pray

[00:07:14] together, purposefully regularly as both events and a lifestyle. And the Lord put that on our hearts to begin with that. And that time we had committed to say any, any leaders, any staff,

[00:07:30] any, any movement, any ministry is going to come out of that prayer time. If the people don't come out of that, if the idea of ministry doesn't come out of that, then we don't want it to be

[00:07:42] something of ourselves. And we've seen that grow in these seven years when we began, there was less than 10 of us. And now we have usually over a hundred and our church is not large. We're

[00:07:59] a church of anywhere for about 250 to 300. And so we have about 100 people coming and give or take any given month, but it we saw huge amounts of people come during that that you know, you could

[00:08:13] go to jail for going to church kind of a thought when the pressure was on, people knew that that was one of the most important things. It built relationship and it got the focus on the Lord correctly.

[00:08:26] And so that is one of the driving forces of our church. And I said, I will cancel every ministry just to do this one. And we do ask him to fast from food for 24 hours. We get together. We pray

[00:08:40] well I have a loose structure. Sometimes we change it. Sometimes we'll highlight different things coming up locally or in missionaries lives, but then we you know what will have some some guided prayer, some open times of prayer, times of gifts being used and then you know some worship,

[00:08:59] musical worship involved in that then we'll then we'll all feast together. We'll break the fast and have communion and then eat together. And that's been one of the most unifying refreshing and motivating times for the church that I can think of. And I just love that.

[00:09:19] That's been integral in what the Lord's done and healing us as the church and then directing us in unity to stand for them on the gospel. Sounds great man, it's low to be part of that.

[00:09:33] That sounds like a lot of fun. I don't like the 24 hours without food part but I can handle it. I got plenty of excess energy in myself. Now that's cool. That's really cool. It's the love feast. It's the love feast that follows that setting myself apart

[00:09:54] for just the Lord. You know, not going to be taken time with food during this time. That sounds wonderful. So so much going on. You you know the the calling part of things,

[00:10:08] Jack, huge and what we've been talking about but you've been sharing with us the accepting that we're in the culture. So let's let's trust the Lord to go to the culture rather than just waiting

[00:10:23] for the culture to come to us. A conviction, a strong conviction that light outshines darkness and God who commanded the light to shine out of darkness has shown in our hearts

[00:10:37] to proclaim the light of the glorious gospel of Jesus Christ in the face of God. You know that that whole thing, you know it's just it's just new covenant all over the place. You know and

[00:10:50] then you may the comment about if we have the culture that the Lord wants to produce in us, it's it's you didn't use the word segue but it's a it's a simple segue over to being a

[00:11:04] persecutor church or it's a simple segue to adjusting to other things that the culture might throw out us and you guys are you guys aren't angry anybody you're not you're not trying to mount an offensive against the darkness in the flesh you're just being the church and

[00:11:24] doing it joyfully and happily and it's all out of a sense of calling and you may the comment I don't mind conflict, you know when we talk the other day and in the people they don't mind

[00:11:40] mixing with the culture that doesn't believe like they do because they know they have the light it's Jesus living inside of them so you refer to the difference between ministering and

[00:11:52] moral bay and north bend I know that that's something that has been on your heart just what is it that the Lord has put on your heart to share with pastors to encourage them or exhort them

[00:12:04] or perhaps even comfort factors and I and I share those three words encourage exhort or comfort because they're right or first Corinthians 14 three and I don't know if you share this conviction

[00:12:14] jack but I I hold this conviction very very deeply I believe that every Christian has the capacity when anointed by the spirit to prophesy to another Christian and I'm not talking about predicting things about their lives I'm talking about speaking to another Christian in the anointing of the

[00:12:33] spirit to encourage them to exhort them or to comfort them and I think that's that's what keeps the church alive and keeps it going and that's apparently what's going on in your monthly meetings

[00:12:48] and in a lot of other environments that's why the church is on fire you know it's like my old the parable of the pee that I learned years ago when I was eating a plate of hot peas and

[00:13:00] one of the peas rolled off the top and I jabbed it with my fork to eat it and it was already cold and I realized why because I heard rolled off the top of the pile of hot peas and I was

[00:13:13] having an epiphany right there at the dinner table jack and I said I said to my family the a new parable has just been given birth to it's called the parable of the pee when Christians are

[00:13:25] with each other they can stay hot if they roll off the pile they're gonna get cold pretty quickly but you're creating a culture where people are loving it being together so anyway here's your two

[00:13:37] minutes go for it okay I have an encouragement from second Corinthians chapter four and then I'll give two resources that have really helped us the encouragement from second Corinthians chapter four he really book ends this chapter with the phrase do not lose heart both inverse one and then

[00:14:00] in verse 16 and it is kind of the sentiment of what we've been talking about that the glory of the gospel the light of the gospel outshines anything this world has and anything that we think

[00:14:13] we lack or are and it's not about us in both any their pride or in depression or discouragement and so he begins the chapter by saying therefore we do not lose heart and we've received mercy

[00:14:27] we have this ministry and we've renounced the hidden things of shame and then he goes not walking in craftiness nor handling the word of God deceitfully but by the manifestation of the truth

[00:14:39] committing ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God and this has given us a real heart to say I'm gonna be obedient and serve in ministry for an audience of one meaning we're

[00:14:52] going to do what we're called to do not because we think that people will respond or it'll land correctly but we think this is what the Lord's calling us to do and therefore it gives us that ability

[00:15:04] like you see kill to say you know I am called to do this regardless of the response but but obedience is success and we're serving an audience of one we're ministering to the Lord

[00:15:18] like Paul and Barnabas did in Acts when they prayed and fasted and they were set apart they were ministering to the Lord now that phrase not ministering to the people of the community

[00:15:28] but this is a whole call in all of Christendom to say we don't lose heart because this is all about the Lord and we are not gonna handle the word of God deceitfully not shamefully and I think of you know

[00:15:40] Romans 1 16 and 17 when to be not ashamed of the gospel means we're not gonna hide it it's not going to be covered up by anything it's not going to be you know a bait and switch it's not going

[00:15:51] to be candy coated it's not going to be watered down we're going to deliver the whole council of truth and then it ends and then it talks about the discouragement that he went through

[00:16:02] crushed and despair for sake and destroyed and then in our own human lives now used to a comfortable American when when any one of us goes through this we go oh Lord what's wrong how come

[00:16:17] I have this ministry as if now it's something different then in the biblical road that's gone before us you know we've been living in a bubble and in really American culture has been insulated because of our

[00:16:32] constitution in the beginning that that a Christian worldview in some ways was more aligned with an American worldview and we're seeing the reality the spirituality is that we are completely and a theoretical to it in America and so when there are these things discouragement despair

[00:16:49] and this could be personal, ministerially but the life of Jesus and that relationship needs to allow us to continue on to not lose heart even though things are dying around us and our

[00:17:04] men as perishing were being renewed day by day and then 17 verse 17 there for our light of reflection which is but for a moment is working for us a far more exceeding an eternal weight of glory

[00:17:18] we do not look at the things that are seen but are the things that are not seen for the things that are seen or temporary but the things that are not seen are eternal and just really pushing that

[00:17:30] eternal mindset eternal perspective to say Lord what do you want to do here you've reserved our church for this time and for this place time is short the days are evil good over comes evil Lord what

[00:17:45] do you want for us two two points of helpful resources for our leadership culture I meet and pray with our elders every Friday morning we've set up our leadership and staff to be a highly

[00:18:04] relational you become an elder when you are not only meeting the criteria of of Timothy and Titus but that you are overseeing a ministry and these so they're all in the trenches they're all

[00:18:18] serving and all the all decisions get made from that group we meet every week we pray and talk we share our lives where week we're vulnerable we have candor and we are we have each other's backs

[00:18:31] that relationship culture has been the backbone of our church and a book that's really helped foster that is a book by Paul Trip called Lead LEAD and that goes through what a leadership characteristics and relationship should look like we went through that together and that's that was

[00:18:52] beautiful and encouraging and helped us shore up some needed areas of encouragement and then for the church kind of a language of our goal was the anatomy of a disciple a book by Rick Taylor the

[00:19:07] anatomy of a disciple so many believers so few disciples and it just gives some great perspective on what we are called to as Christians much more than than shown up and in watching something or online one way dissemination of information but calling into a personal relationship

[00:19:30] with the living God where we're transformed from the inside out so lead Paul Trip anatomy of disciple Rick Taylor and that's my two minutes two minutes plus yeah but it was good stuff yeah

[00:19:46] thanks Pastor Jack for taking this time to share with us today appreciate being able to hang out with you this way and a lot of food for thought here if you want to get in touch with Jack or you

[00:19:57] have any questions for him just write to stronger pastors at gmail.com and we will be sure to forward them promptly resources from Calvary Mount Sai and Pastor Jack are available will be in the show notes

[00:20:09] for this episode again thanks for joining us and by way of reminder point minestries was formed in 2008 our heart was to and is to strengthen and revitalize churches by helping encouraging the senior

[00:20:23] pastors of those churches please feel free to reach out to us if we can be of help to you in any way and the announcer will give you details on how to connect with us God bless you and may he strengthen

[00:20:37] you in his service in Jesus name strength for today's pastor is sponsored by point minestries you can find us at point minestries.com that spelled P O I M E N ministries.com if something in today's program prompts a question or comment or if you have a

[00:20:56] topic idea for a future episode just shoot us an email at stronger pastors at gmail.com that's stronger pastors at gmail.com may the Lord bless you as you serve him his pastors and his church