Brenda Leavenworth Part 2

[00:00:04] Welcome to Women Worth Knowing, the radio program and podcast hosted by Cheryl Brodersen and Robin Jones Gunn.

[00:00:11] We are ready for Part 2 with Brenda Leavenworth.

[00:00:14] We have gotten this sort of overview of what it was like to grow up in certain parts of Southern California.

[00:00:22] You have to listen to the first episode to get all of it.

[00:00:25] Exactly, as a Scottish girl.

[00:00:27] Yes.

[00:00:27] As a girl with a Highland dancer.

[00:00:29] As a Highland dancer.

[00:00:31] Yes.

[00:00:32] With bagpipe playing brothers.

[00:00:34] Yes.

[00:00:34] The sweetness of how the Lord drew you to himself and how you responded and how you and your husband continued to respond now that you were out in the, not Temecula yet, were you?

[00:00:47] Yeah, we were in Menifee, which is a couple towns over from Temecula.

[00:00:51] And it was just a brand new community that was opening up.

[00:00:55] And Ted was actually a paramedic in that area.

[00:00:58] And we had just moved to Moreno Valley like a year earlier.

[00:01:01] He's like, you have to come see this area.

[00:01:03] Yeah.

[00:01:04] So he saw a lot of chalk marks.

[00:01:06] That's all I'm saying.

[00:01:07] Okay.

[00:01:07] As a paramedic.

[00:01:08] Listen to episode one.

[00:01:10] So, Brenda, you know, we talked in episode one about how, you know, you kind of inadvertently

[00:01:17] started the Calvary Chapel out there.

[00:01:19] The first Calvary Chapel inadvertently.

[00:01:21] You guys were kind of part of the founders of it.

[00:01:23] And we had just brought Ted on staff when we did the last one.

[00:01:28] And then how long did Ted serve as like an assistant pastor or, you know?

[00:01:34] So we started the church in 92 and started in our home.

[00:01:40] And we just kind of had these visions of people sitting up the stairs.

[00:01:43] And that happened.

[00:01:45] And then six months later, we rented a little drama room at a middle school.

[00:01:49] So they brought him on.

[00:01:51] He became a pastor in 94.

[00:01:54] So two years into the church, he became the assistant pastor.

[00:01:58] And we served there for 15 years.

[00:02:01] He ended up becoming, the church grew very large to like 6,500 people.

[00:02:06] Wow.

[00:02:06] In Menifee.

[00:02:07] Yes.

[00:02:08] Of all places.

[00:02:09] And when we left, it was, we had served 15 years.

[00:02:14] He was served as the executive pastor for several of those, probably maybe a few years into his

[00:02:21] pastorship.

[00:02:21] He became the XP and just kind of like did, ran the church.

[00:02:28] And then in one day, I mean, we thought, so my dad built the building we were in.

[00:02:34] Your dad, Cheryl, Pastor Chuck came out and dedicated it.

[00:02:37] Dedicated it, right.

[00:02:39] And so my dad built the building.

[00:02:42] We had chalk marks underneath where they were all going to get married.

[00:02:45] Good chalk marks.

[00:02:47] You know, chalk is coming up a lot in this episode, in these episodes, yes.

[00:02:54] There's a theme about chalk.

[00:02:55] Yeah.

[00:02:56] So, and we thought we were going to die there.

[00:02:59] Like this was our, this was our baby.

[00:03:02] And God showed us so much through that transition.

[00:03:04] But in one day, my husband was headed into the office and the Lord said to him, you're

[00:03:09] done here.

[00:03:10] Wow.

[00:03:10] And if you stay, you're going to be in sin.

[00:03:13] Wow.

[00:03:14] And you need to leave.

[00:03:15] And he came home and he said, the Lord had told me that we're done.

[00:03:19] And, you know, being the good pastor's wife, I was like, you better be sure.

[00:03:24] Yeah.

[00:03:26] I've had that conversation before.

[00:03:27] Yes.

[00:03:28] Those moments are so difficult.

[00:03:30] It's like, Lord, you told him you have to tell me.

[00:03:32] Yes.

[00:03:33] Who?

[00:03:33] Seriously.

[00:03:34] Seriously.

[00:03:35] I'm like, you got to look me in the eye and tell me you've prayed about this.

[00:03:38] You heard the Lord.

[00:03:39] You know that this is it.

[00:03:40] He said he wasn't completely sure, but he was like, yes, yes, yes.

[00:03:44] But the Lord did confirm it to me.

[00:03:48] And I just told him, like, my wagons hit cheers and where you're going to go, I'm going

[00:03:53] to go.

[00:03:54] I hope you know where we're going.

[00:03:56] He didn't.

[00:03:56] We didn't know.

[00:03:57] It was kind of an Abraham call.

[00:03:59] And long story short, we ended up planting two cities over in Temecula.

[00:04:07] And he became the senior pastor at that point.

[00:04:10] And so that church is still going.

[00:04:12] What's the name of your church?

[00:04:13] Reliance Church in Temecula.

[00:04:15] In Temecula.

[00:04:16] Great name.

[00:04:17] So how long have you been there now?

[00:04:19] So we started in 2007.

[00:04:21] So we're, what are we, 17, 18 years now?

[00:04:26] So I had heard of you, but I met you when you took my Bible college class.

[00:04:32] Because, you know, by this time, Calvary's bought Murrieta, which they have since sold.

[00:04:37] But they bought Murrieta and we had a Bible college there and we had retreats there for

[00:04:42] a time.

[00:04:42] And I actually taught and was in my class.

[00:04:44] And I had heard so many great things about, because I had heard, which is interesting.

[00:04:50] You didn't really feel comfortable teaching the Bible, but you made this video.

[00:04:56] You made like a, you made like a series.

[00:04:59] You remember it?

[00:05:00] No.

[00:05:00] You just had the stuff like I did?

[00:05:02] The one about a virtuous woman and.

[00:05:04] Oh, yes.

[00:05:05] So talk a little bit about kind of your, you know, how you got from your reluctance to

[00:05:12] what you're doing now.

[00:05:13] Like, what was the process?

[00:05:16] So my call into teaching was through Hebrews when the Lord said, it was more of a rebuke,

[00:05:23] really.

[00:05:24] By now you should be teaching, but you're still in need of milk.

[00:05:29] And that was really my call to like, you need to, you need to intentionally study, to study,

[00:05:36] to be prepared to teach.

[00:05:37] And so that was my wake up call from the Lord.

[00:05:40] Like.

[00:05:41] At what point?

[00:05:41] That was after 15 years of the first church?

[00:05:44] No, this was probably during.

[00:05:46] During that time.

[00:05:47] So you started the home church and then on.

[00:05:50] Yeah.

[00:05:50] Staff.

[00:05:51] And then during Revival Christian Fellowship, it had three different names, but ended up

[00:05:57] now it's called Revival.

[00:05:58] And it was during that time when I got my call to teach the Bible.

[00:06:03] But you have to know some background.

[00:06:05] I was at El Camino College in Torrance and I was supposed to take a communications class

[00:06:10] and I dropped out because I do not speak in front of people.

[00:06:16] It's not a natural gifting.

[00:06:20] So I think I'm one of those reluctant servants where the Lord's like, okay, you're going to

[00:06:24] do this.

[00:06:25] I'm like, no, I'm not.

[00:06:26] I'm not good at that.

[00:06:27] So that was that.

[00:06:28] But then he had tried, he called me to write a study in Proverbs 31 to just for young women.

[00:06:37] And I was taking a class at the Bible college and I felt this call compelling them.

[00:06:44] And I was like, I'm not a writer.

[00:06:46] And that's not false humility.

[00:06:48] I'm not a writer.

[00:06:50] I don't even know if I could write a pamphlet, God.

[00:06:53] And you're asking me to write this Bible study.

[00:06:57] And I said, okay, I'll pray about it.

[00:07:00] And I'll talk to you some more about it.

[00:07:02] Can I get back to you?

[00:07:03] Easy out.

[00:07:05] So that week, the Bible college called me.

[00:07:09] It was Andy Dean.

[00:07:10] And he said, we were praying.

[00:07:11] Holy Spirit brought your name.

[00:07:12] We want you to teach this class.

[00:07:15] And I said, okay.

[00:07:16] I had just said two weeks ago, sounded like torture to ever teach at a Bible college.

[00:07:22] And he said, we want you to teach this class.

[00:07:24] And I go, okay, I'll pray about this.

[00:07:27] What is it?

[00:07:28] And he said, Proverbs 31.

[00:07:29] I was like, of course it was.

[00:07:32] You're going to make me study this.

[00:07:34] And so through that class, I began to study.

[00:07:37] And I literally sat down on my computer.

[00:07:40] And I said, okay, Lord, I will do this.

[00:07:43] And I'm like, you're going to have to tell me what to say.

[00:07:46] Because I have nothing.

[00:07:48] I have nothing.

[00:07:49] So I put my fingers in.

[00:07:50] And I was like, okay, go.

[00:07:53] I love it.

[00:07:54] It's that simple.

[00:07:55] So that opened up the door for Far Above Rubies, which is, I think, the series you're talking about.

[00:08:00] And so we did some videos that went along with it.

[00:08:04] And, yeah, it was fun.

[00:08:06] And the videos are classic because they're funny.

[00:08:10] They're just so fun.

[00:08:12] I mean, it's because I think so many times we've used the Proverbs 31 woman as a measure that there's no way we can.

[00:08:23] So exalted.

[00:08:24] Yeah, right.

[00:08:25] Well, she was real estate.

[00:08:26] She made her own clothes and the clothes for her whole family.

[00:08:31] Up early every morning.

[00:08:33] Yes, bought imported goods.

[00:08:35] Worked out with weight.

[00:08:36] She strengthens her arms.

[00:08:38] I mean, this woman was the whole package.

[00:08:41] Her husband obviously was out of work because he just sat in the gate saying, yeah, I've got a good wife.

[00:08:45] She's earning the money for us.

[00:08:47] And so, you know, when you think about all those things, and I think we've, you know, we've compared ourselves.

[00:08:54] And if you say, oh, yeah, I'm that, then, you know, you've got something wrong with you.

[00:08:58] And if you say, I'll never be that, well, then you're still in bad shape.

[00:09:02] And so this brought this gracious approach to it, which I really appreciated.

[00:09:08] Yeah, you know, as I was studying, I thought, really, this should also be a study for boys because she's obviously not one woman.

[00:09:17] I feel like this is like sort of this, like, this is what, son, this is what you should be looking for.

[00:09:24] Exactly.

[00:09:24] Yeah.

[00:09:25] You know, King Lemuel.

[00:09:26] This is what you should be looking for.

[00:09:27] These are the, I think of it as you're sending your kid to school and you're like, no, pick the kid that's kind.

[00:09:33] Yeah.

[00:09:33] That's gracious.

[00:09:34] And that likes you.

[00:09:36] And that honors his parents.

[00:09:37] Like, these are like a thing that, you know, these are characteristics.

[00:09:43] And so.

[00:09:44] Yeah.

[00:09:44] Well, my mom used to say, remember, it was written by the mother-in-law, you know, and it is like when you're talking to your sons, you are saying, please find somebody.

[00:09:54] A list of qualifications.

[00:09:55] Yes.

[00:09:56] You know, for the daughter-in-law.

[00:09:58] Well, think about Rebecca in the Bible.

[00:10:00] And she said to Isaac, you know, please don't let Jacob marry anybody like the wives of Esau.

[00:10:09] They're going to be my death.

[00:10:11] And I think they were her early death.

[00:10:13] So anyway, so you started there.

[00:10:16] And then, you know, from there you began to teach.

[00:10:23] Yeah.

[00:10:24] So from there, I think I ended up teaching at the Bible college for about six years there in Myriad.

[00:10:31] And I taught Proverbs 31.

[00:10:33] And that was sort of that introduction to.

[00:10:35] Did you like it?

[00:10:36] I really did.

[00:10:37] I really, really liked it.

[00:10:39] You know, this sort of setup of the reluctant servant.

[00:10:43] Yes.

[00:10:44] Yes.

[00:10:44] We've heard this before.

[00:10:46] Yeah.

[00:10:46] Yeah.

[00:10:46] Just like, not me, somebody else.

[00:10:49] I'll suggest it to someone.

[00:10:50] Yeah.

[00:10:50] A recurring theme.

[00:10:51] Yes.

[00:10:52] I mean, way back to Moses.

[00:10:54] Exactly.

[00:10:56] Yes.

[00:10:56] I can't speak.

[00:10:57] But it's in our weakness that he's strong.

[00:11:01] Yeah.

[00:11:01] And it's so beautiful to hear these stories.

[00:11:03] And I love that you're sharing that just so authentically and honestly, because I know that there are listeners who have been invited to do something.

[00:11:12] Or the Lord has nudged them.

[00:11:13] The Holy Spirit has nudged them over and over.

[00:11:17] This is what I want you to do.

[00:11:18] And right away, they look at their qualifications or they look at their natural ability.

[00:11:22] Or their past.

[00:11:23] Yes.

[00:11:23] Exactly.

[00:11:24] Like, no, no, no.

[00:11:25] I wouldn't qualify.

[00:11:27] And yet, it's the Lord.

[00:11:29] It's his power.

[00:11:29] It's his strength in this earthen vessel that we're walking around in.

[00:11:34] And those stories, the more we share them, the more I know it opens up for others to say, well, I'm going to trust God in a new way, in a big way, and see what he wants to do in me and through me and sometimes in spite of me.

[00:11:50] Amen.

[00:11:50] So thank you for being just so honest about that.

[00:11:53] But we need to hear that.

[00:11:54] Yes.

[00:11:54] Okay.

[00:11:54] So I want to get to when did you start kind of teaching regularly?

[00:11:58] And when was the call to leadership?

[00:12:02] So leadership seems to always have been in the – but I'm not – I wasn't a natural-born leader.

[00:12:09] I don't think I was one to, like, you know, spur the troops.

[00:12:12] I really do think it's a spiritual gift.

[00:12:15] Which makes it even better.

[00:12:16] Yeah, because it's God.

[00:12:18] So it's, like, that's perfect, right?

[00:12:20] Yes.

[00:12:21] So I've always had an inclination towards leadership.

[00:12:24] The call to teach came, and then the invitations came, and they weren't quick.

[00:12:30] It wasn't like everybody's blowing up my phone.

[00:12:34] Like, it was gradual.

[00:12:35] You know, and where he invited, I would go.

[00:12:38] And so that just became more and more, you know, retreats, events.

[00:12:45] And then the teaching thing at the college, I ended up deciding that I wanted to pursue my bachelor's degree.

[00:12:53] So I ended that – I did that, like, not that long ago, probably five or six years I finished my master's.

[00:13:00] I just really wanted to go to my bachelor's degree, but then I was going to Calvary Chapel University, and they called me and said,

[00:13:07] Hey, if you do your master's, like, basically we'll pay for it if you'll teach here.

[00:13:13] Wow.

[00:13:13] So I currently teach in the women's department at Calvary Chapel University, and I was able to actually, like, create a lot of their women's classes and put them together, which that excites me.

[00:13:25] I just have a hunger to study, and if God can use that and he wants to invite me out, then I go.

[00:13:33] So it was just, like, kind of this gradual thing.

[00:13:36] But I love leadership.

[00:13:37] My master's actually in leadership.

[00:13:39] Mine too.

[00:13:40] Yeah.

[00:13:40] But one of the things that I find really interesting, too, is that as a reluctant leader, because believe it or not, because everyone thinks because I'm Chuck Smith's daughter and Kay Smith's daughter, that my mom was reluctant.

[00:13:51] And this was not – it was not – I'm an introvert.

[00:13:58] Believe it or not, I'm 99% introvert.

[00:14:00] I'd rather serve brisket behind the counter than, like, put myself out there.

[00:14:06] And yet that's the call.

[00:14:09] And I think what people don't realize is a lot of times when you're leading, you're dying to yourself.

[00:14:13] Right.

[00:14:14] And there are those out there that are going, how come she gets to lead?

[00:14:17] Like Korah, you know, about Moses.

[00:14:18] Why does he get to lead?

[00:14:19] And they don't understand Moses.

[00:14:21] Like, really, I'd like to give this away, but God won't let me.

[00:14:24] You know, this is the call on my life.

[00:14:28] That's really good, Cheryl.

[00:14:28] That's so true.

[00:14:29] It is.

[00:14:30] And I have to –

[00:14:31] I'm just being obedient.

[00:14:32] Obey it.

[00:14:32] Right.

[00:14:33] Well, like, even with you writing, why do you write?

[00:14:35] Oh, yeah.

[00:14:35] That was never my idea.

[00:14:36] And why isn't my book accepted?

[00:14:38] And you're like, I don't know.

[00:14:40] I just know.

[00:14:41] Woe is me if I don't obey the Lord.

[00:14:44] Jesus asked me to do this.

[00:14:45] I said, okay.

[00:14:46] Yeah.

[00:14:47] Try it.

[00:14:48] Hold on.

[00:14:49] So now you're – I want to talk about what you're doing right now when she leads.

[00:14:57] And I want to know, where did you get that title?

[00:15:02] Because it's such a good one.

[00:15:03] Yes, exactly.

[00:15:04] And what is it?

[00:15:06] And where are you going with it?

[00:15:08] Because I know you just got back from something very exciting.

[00:15:11] And I want to make sure we get this in.

[00:15:15] So I didn't have a title.

[00:15:18] I just had kind of a vision from the Lord where he just showed me that there are women all over the world that serve in their churches and lead.

[00:15:31] And in sometimes really high calling places.

[00:15:35] They're running finances of the church or, you know, they're doing some really big works.

[00:15:41] And all the way down to the servants who make the coffee.

[00:15:46] And I just saw this sort of like there's no one for them to connect to in other organizations.

[00:15:53] Pastors have done a great job of networking, I feel like.

[00:15:57] But where were we to go as women?

[00:16:00] And your mom had such a beautiful vision for pastors, wives.

[00:16:06] But then there's also these – all these other leaders within the church.

[00:16:09] Where do the single women go?

[00:16:11] Where do the women whose husbands aren't saved?

[00:16:13] Where do they get to connect with?

[00:16:15] And so I just saw all these women serving the Lord but not having that encouragement, equipping, connecting.

[00:16:23] That was the original vision.

[00:16:25] The original vision was just – he kind of laid out the whole thing.

[00:16:29] But initially we did the –

[00:16:30] Kind of like the tabernacle.

[00:16:32] This is what you're about.

[00:16:34] Whole things start here.

[00:16:36] So yeah, we did a podcast and we geared that towards leadership.

[00:16:39] And you're still doing the podcast.

[00:16:41] We do.

[00:16:41] And it's called –

[00:16:42] When She Leads.

[00:16:43] When She Leads.

[00:16:44] And so we just started the podcast and then God said, okay, it's time to do some conferences.

[00:16:51] And we weren't going after pastor's wives.

[00:16:54] We were going after women who just want to serve God and want to know that somebody is in the trenches with them.

[00:17:01] And so we just opened that up.

[00:17:04] And that was exciting because I kind of planned some domestic ones.

[00:17:09] I never understood or saw the international component.

[00:17:13] And we've been to Brazil.

[00:17:15] We just got back from Madrid and Portugal.

[00:17:18] We've been in Ireland.

[00:17:20] I'm going to England in July.

[00:17:21] And God's just – I think we've hit a niche of women who are just ready to be encouraged, to be equipped, to be connected.

[00:17:30] And then recently we just started Zoom cohorts.

[00:17:34] So they're very specific.

[00:17:36] So if you're a writer, you can go into a writing speaker, speaking cohort.

[00:17:41] If you're a church administrator, we got a big – everybody wants to learn planning center.

[00:17:48] So the next one we're going to do is just for admins who want to learn more about planning center.

[00:17:54] So it's just been really, really neat.

[00:17:57] I've had missionaries just this past – a couple weeks ago when we were in Madrid.

[00:18:03] And she said, you know, I'm way out in the middle of nowhere.

[00:18:07] And I go for this walk and I listen to your podcast every time I go on this walk.

[00:18:12] And she said, you have no idea what this is doing for me.

[00:18:16] And that's testimony after testimony of people just saying, thank you.

[00:18:21] It just makes me feel connected.

[00:18:23] You know, I know when Brandon and I were in England for four years and I was doing Sunday school.

[00:18:28] I was doing retreats, women brunches, the women's Bible study, and trying to homeschool.

[00:18:35] And it was, you know, way, way too much.

[00:18:39] And, you know, God bless husbands, but sometimes they're like, here's another ministry.

[00:18:44] Take this one too.

[00:18:45] And you're just like, I'm already pretty laden down.

[00:18:49] But one of the things is I know I craved teaching from women.

[00:18:54] And we had teaching from men.

[00:18:56] But I said to my mom, you know, send me some of your cassettes.

[00:19:00] She's like, oh, you don't want my cassettes.

[00:19:02] You know everything.

[00:19:02] I'm going to say anyway.

[00:19:03] I'll get you some other ones.

[00:19:05] And she sent me Jill Briscoe.

[00:19:06] She sent me – I can't remember.

[00:19:09] Oh, I think I got a couple Kate Arthur.

[00:19:12] Later on I discovered Carol Mayhall.

[00:19:15] And I listened to those until they were not magnetized anymore.

[00:19:20] Like they were garbled.

[00:19:21] Because I just wanted to hear from other women who were leading, who were doing this.

[00:19:28] And, you know, I needed someone to say that's too much.

[00:19:32] It's all right to lay some things down.

[00:19:35] It's all right not to do everything or be everything to everybody.

[00:19:40] And, you know, that women need women.

[00:19:44] You know, I have a girlfriend and we always talk about – we're both married.

[00:19:48] And we just talk about how much we get these girls get-togethers.

[00:19:53] And we just talk about like, oh, your husband does that too?

[00:19:56] So that's a man thing.

[00:19:57] Because men always kind of make us feel a little bad that we're not a man.

[00:20:01] You know what I mean?

[00:20:01] They don't mean to be.

[00:20:02] But like, hey, that's nothing.

[00:20:03] Do you know what I did?

[00:20:04] Or like you say, I didn't get very good sleep.

[00:20:06] You didn't get very good sleep.

[00:20:08] I only slept for two hours.

[00:20:09] But look what I'm doing.

[00:20:10] I ran 10 miles.

[00:20:11] You're like, well, don't you think that might be you?

[00:20:14] And, you know, but there's those things with men.

[00:20:17] And so you get together with women and we're like, oh.

[00:20:19] So men do that.

[00:20:21] And we're okay being women.

[00:20:23] And we kind of go back to our husbands going, I'm a woman.

[00:20:26] Hear me roar, you know?

[00:20:27] Now, let's bring to when you go, especially Brazil.

[00:20:30] Yeah, yeah.

[00:20:30] What are you doing with the – you gather the women together for –

[00:20:36] Yes.

[00:20:37] Yes, tell us all about it.

[00:20:39] So my friend who was a missionary in Brazil, she had asked me, would you ever come to Brazil?

[00:20:46] And here goes the theme again.

[00:20:48] I said, no.

[00:20:50] No, I would never.

[00:20:52] I asked my husband if I can go on the Philippines trip.

[00:20:54] And he said, you would be a detriment to the team.

[00:20:59] Okay.

[00:21:00] Thank you, honey.

[00:21:01] And honest answer is a kiss on the lips.

[00:21:03] He knows me and it has to do with some physical things.

[00:21:06] But then when she came back and said, I want to do it when she leads, God gave me complete peace.

[00:21:13] And it was one of the most – ten most dangerous cities in Brazil other than in war-torn areas.

[00:21:20] And God gave me complete peace.

[00:21:22] Hence why God raised you in Carson.

[00:21:24] Yes.

[00:21:25] There you go.

[00:21:25] In the white chalk.

[00:21:26] So you have a gathering that the women sign up for ahead of time.

[00:21:32] Mm-hmm.

[00:21:32] And then you do the teaching.

[00:21:35] We have a team of teachers.

[00:21:37] And you have translators and other teachers.

[00:21:38] Yeah.

[00:21:38] I have – so we have a core team of four people right now.

[00:21:43] Krista Fox, Rosemary Katie, Kelly Bell, and myself.

[00:21:46] And so when we go to conferences, it depends on what they need.

[00:21:52] We kind of customize it to their area.

[00:21:54] We always try and have a local teacher join alongside.

[00:21:57] We always try and have servants from their church to partner with us.

[00:22:02] I have a larger team that does the cohorts of about 20 ladies.

[00:22:05] And so this time when we were going to Madrid, they wanted a workshop that Mika Buffington, Bill Buffington's wife, does.

[00:22:14] I just called Mika and said, hey, I have this opportunity.

[00:22:17] You want to go on a trip?

[00:22:18] She's like, yeah.

[00:22:19] So she ended up coming to Madrid.

[00:22:21] So the teams change slightly as the need – as the Lord directs.

[00:22:27] So we do like a Friday night, usually Saturday.

[00:22:30] And we do some main sessions.

[00:22:32] We pray.

[00:22:33] This time in Madrid, we did a missionary day where all the lady missionaries came in.

[00:22:37] Oh, wonderful.

[00:22:38] And we just poured into them, prayed together.

[00:22:42] I love this.

[00:22:42] Yeah, it's just been like –

[00:22:44] We'll put this in the show notes too so that the website and the link –

[00:22:48] Yeah.

[00:22:48] – so that those who are listening can find out how to connect.

[00:22:51] Because it's really non-denominational too.

[00:22:53] It's for whoever wants to come.

[00:22:55] Yeah, the women that need that support and encouragement and the fellowship.

[00:22:59] It's such a gift.

[00:23:01] Yeah, just to spend that time with the Lord.

[00:23:03] And you asked me where I got the name.

[00:23:05] And I went to this conference.

[00:23:08] It was called She Speaks in North Carolina, Lisa Perkers.

[00:23:11] And I went to that a few times because I needed help.

[00:23:14] And they had writing tracks and teaching tracks.

[00:23:17] And I just love that name so cute.

[00:23:20] So I wanted to just do She Leads.

[00:23:22] And then – but that was taken.

[00:23:24] And so I started thinking about these things.

[00:23:26] And I came up with When She Leads.

[00:23:28] I actually would like to change it to like where She Leads.

[00:23:32] Because I think that better describes it.

[00:23:34] Yeah.

[00:23:34] I don't know if I can.

[00:23:35] But then when I remembered that you had When Leaders Lead, I was like –

[00:23:41] You're welcome to it.

[00:23:42] Oh, my gosh.

[00:23:42] You're welcome to it.

[00:23:43] It's not in use anymore.

[00:23:45] I was thinking, I wonder if she wants to take that one.

[00:23:48] Because I like that because it was the song of Deborah.

[00:23:51] But it's only in the – it's one of the translations.

[00:23:54] I think it might be New King James.

[00:23:56] It's not in the other translations.

[00:23:58] But, yeah, you're welcome to it.

[00:24:00] I really like When She Leads.

[00:24:01] Yeah.

[00:24:02] I like When She Leads because it's as if it's setting an app of when she leads, this is what God does.

[00:24:07] That's true.

[00:24:08] This is what happens.

[00:24:08] Yeah.

[00:24:08] You know, where is like you have to have that destination figured out ahead of time?

[00:24:13] Yeah.

[00:24:13] We never do.

[00:24:13] The only thing is that you don't want men to think, you know, I'm in the lead.

[00:24:18] And they have.

[00:24:19] They have.

[00:24:19] Yeah.

[00:24:20] And it's like it's not about you.

[00:24:23] Well, and it's just – it's such a silly concept to think like, okay, we're going to be women and we're going to take over all the men's jobs.

[00:24:30] It's like –

[00:24:31] No.

[00:24:31] It's not what it's about.

[00:24:32] No.

[00:24:32] Because, you know, when you're leading in your home, you're children.

[00:24:36] And you have those opportunities to lead.

[00:24:38] You know, it's about that.

[00:24:41] And, you know, I'm so excited about this ministry and what you're doing.

[00:24:46] And, you know, I follow you on Instagram, which those of you who want to follow Brenda on Instagram, we're going to post all of that.

[00:24:54] Again, the ministry is when she leads.

[00:24:57] Maybe you're out there and you're like, I'm in leadership at my church.

[00:25:00] I would love to have something like this come to where I am.

[00:25:05] And you can get in touch with Brenda and maybe begin to set it up.

[00:25:08] Brenda, thank you for joining us.

[00:25:10] Thank you.

[00:25:38] Thank you.

[00:25:43] We hope you've enjoyed today's episode.

[00:25:45] Make sure you rate us on your podcast app, subscribe, and share it with a friend.

[00:25:49] Thank you again for listening to Women Worth Knowing with Cheryl Broderson and Robin Jones-Gunn.

[00:25:55] Women Worth Knowing is a production of Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa.