A Roundtable On Fatherhood
* Jesus Famous with Nate HoldridgeMay 31, 2023x
57
01:20:14110.24 MB

A Roundtable On Fatherhood

As Father's Day approaches the corner, Nate has a roundtable discussion with some fathers of Calvary Monterey. Nate and guys discuss some parenting methods, practical ways of fathering, and insights to everyday life. We hope this episode gives great wisdom and biblical insight as you father, prepare for fatherhood, or glean for a dad you know. 

Follow Pastor Nate:
Website:
nateholdridge.com
Instagram:
@nateholdridge
Church:
calvary.com


Resources Mentioned in Today's Episode:
Celebration of Discipline: The Path to Spiritual Growth by Richard Foster
Grace Based Parenting: Set Your Family Tree
Emotionally Healthy Spirituality: It's Impossible to Be Spiritually Mature, While Remaining Emotionally Immature by Peter Scazzero
ESV Bible
Dear New Dad by Nate Holdridge
Habits of the Household: Practicing the Story of God in Everyday Family Rhythms by Justin Early
The Intentional Father: A Practical Guide to Raise Sons of Courage and Character by Jon Tyson

[00:00:12] Alright, hey everyone. Welcome to episode 176 of the Jesus Famous podcast. We exist to see Jesus

[00:00:20] honored, glorified, loved, esteemed, appreciated, adored, revered and followed Jesus Famous in your

[00:00:27] everyday life. I'm Nate Holdridge, your host today and pastor of Calvary Monterey on the

[00:00:32] California Central Coast. I preach about Jesus Famous on Sundays but like to write and podcast

[00:00:38] about Jesus Famous during the week at NateHoldridge.com. Our show consists of interviews and discussions

[00:00:45] and stories that we think will help propel you further into an appreciation of Jesus. On today's

[00:00:52] episode, we're going to have a round table discussion with a group of men, fathers and pastors

[00:01:01] that I serve with here at Calvary Monterey. I admire every one of these guys as dads and you

[00:01:06] are really going to enjoy this discussion. If you're a want to be father, hoping to have kids at

[00:01:13] some point in the future. If you're an older father who's trying to figure out how to father your

[00:01:18] adult children. If you're just getting started whatever stage you're at I think you're going

[00:01:23] to enjoy this conversation. Each man around the table has a different perspective. Some of them

[00:01:29] are just getting started in their role as a dad. Others of them are in their latter or

[00:01:35] older years of parenting their kids. Each man at the table has a different background. Some of us

[00:01:41] had both of our parents raising us. Others of us only had our mom raising us. Some of us

[00:01:48] lived in toxic homes and environments as you'll hear as the episode progresses. But having

[00:01:55] done this recording already, I know you're going to be greatly encouraged by this episode. Stick

[00:02:00] around for the very end when Pastor Manny gives a rock solid exhortation to close out our time

[00:02:08] together. So I know you're going to be blessed by this conversation and thanks again for listening

[00:02:14] to the Jesus famous podcast. All right, here we are with the guys in the studio and we're

[00:02:27] getting ready to talk about being a dad. You might be listening to this episode,

[00:02:34] you know, really at any point we're releasing it near Father's Day. So kind of an on calendar or on

[00:02:42] brand episode. But you know, it's going to be timeless in nature. It's not just how to this

[00:02:48] is a podcast on how to navigate Father's Day. It's a it's going to be a discussion about

[00:02:53] how to be a dad. And I've already talked about some of the guys have gotten the studio with

[00:03:00] me, but these are all pastors that I respect and have served with for many years here at Calvary

[00:03:06] Monterey. And we're going to go around the table for all of these questions today. And we're going

[00:03:12] to start with just kind of an icebreaker introduction to each guy. And what I'm looking for first

[00:03:18] is to get their dad stats, you know, how long have you been a dad? How many kids you got?

[00:03:24] And you know, that type of thing so we can can know where you're coming from. And then

[00:03:30] just an icebreaker question. What is one of your favorite dad survival tips? So I'm going to start

[00:03:38] with Pastor Riley Monzo first Riley. Welcome to the show man. Once again, my longtime co-host.

[00:03:45] Hey, good to be back. It's good to see you. Well, I'm the youngest dad here I think.

[00:03:50] I have been a dad for two and a half years. Have a daughter. Her name is Meadow Joy. She's

[00:03:57] just the best little girl. I just love being a dad. My wife and I have been married for seven years.

[00:04:03] So we started a few years into marriage. I'm having kids. And you want me to go into my dad's

[00:04:09] survival tip? Yeah, man. What's one of your favorite dad survival tips? Well,

[00:04:13] um, my favorite thing to do since being a dad has been naps. I've turned into a nap guy. I don't

[00:04:21] know if you guys are nap guys, but oh heck yeah, I do the 20 minute nap kind of midday when my daughter

[00:04:26] goes down for a nap. I usually go down for a nap too about 20 minutes. Any longer is brutal,

[00:04:31] but 20 minutes has been good. It just gives me enough juice to get through the day. So

[00:04:37] that's really helped out especially during bedtime at night. I don't fall asleep when she's

[00:04:40] falling asleep. That's great. You stay awake. I stay awake to tuck her in. Yeah, that's good.

[00:04:45] I was curious if it was like a, is it a simultaneous nap? Meadow snapping and your

[00:04:50] napping. So it sounds like you will take advantage because I know there's a little bit

[00:04:54] of pressure when they take a nap. It's kind of like you feel the pressure like,

[00:04:58] I gotta get stuff done. This is my time to shine now, but you will indulge.

[00:05:03] She goes down. I go down. I like it. Yeah. I like it. All right. And then the next

[00:05:08] pastor and man and father that I've got with me is a pastor, Mike Casey. Mike, what are your

[00:05:15] dad's stats? And what's one of your favorite dad survival tips? Well, I have been a dad

[00:05:21] for 37 years, which is kind of surprising to me. And I think for me, I have a unique

[00:05:31] time of being a father because the first probably half of my kid's life I was not present.

[00:05:37] My two oldest, Ryan and Sarah were in high school when I got sober and met Christ.

[00:05:45] My youngest two were in middle school and my youngest was being homeschooled.

[00:05:49] And so I would say I didn't really even start becoming a father until the two

[00:05:55] oldest were halfway through their lives. And so I think for me it's just being

[00:06:01] present with your kids because all kids really want is a parent. They're not looking for

[00:06:09] perfection. They're not looking for always the always the right answer or the right thing.

[00:06:16] They just they want their mom or their dad to be in their life, whatever that looks like. And my

[00:06:21] kids never gave up that hope. And so I would say for me it's just being present in their

[00:06:27] lives and to watch all of those years of disappointment just wash away like the blood

[00:06:34] of Christ and just watch them be accepting and happy to have a dad regardless. So I get to see

[00:06:39] them at church now as a pastor. And it's like, it's a whole new ball game. And they're proud

[00:06:47] of me and I'm proud of them. And it's just a joy watching them grow and watching Christ work

[00:06:53] in their lives. Hey man bro, that's the reason that I wanted to have you be part of this discussion.

[00:07:00] You know if I've got Riley on as the guy who's like, hey, you've got a little toddler running

[00:07:06] around and you're just brand new your marriage has been intruded on by this new life and person.

[00:07:13] I wanted to have you on because you're an excellent dad and I know that that's your

[00:07:18] past and your history. And I've watched how you have just thrown yourself into the lives of your

[00:07:25] children, your adult children and you're there for them. You're always barbecuing with them and

[00:07:29] doing stuff. You're one of the busiest guys I know, but you make time for your kids and it's

[00:07:33] really stood out to me how they have embraced you as dad. Even though those younger years

[00:07:40] you wish you could have done them a little bit differently. And I'm sure you're not the only

[00:07:43] person, you know, there's plenty of people listening to this today. And you wish that

[00:07:48] your past had been different as a dad, but God has something new for you in the future. You can't

[00:07:54] change what has come or what has already occurred, but you can change what will happen in the years

[00:08:00] to come. So Mike, thanks so much for giving us that encouragement. The next pastor I got with me

[00:08:07] is Pastor Manny Colazo. Hey, hey, Manny and I have known each other for many years. Manny,

[00:08:13] what's your, what are your dad stats and what's one of your favorite survival tips? I can't

[00:08:17] wait to hear this. Well, we started super early having children. I was 21 when I had my first son

[00:08:24] and a few years later we had our second son. I've been a dad for 28 years. My oldest, they're both

[00:08:29] boys. They're both men grown up. We've successfully launched them out of the house. My oldest is

[00:08:34] going to be 28. So he's 27 now. My youngest will be 25 this Sunday. Wow, Jonathan. And

[00:08:42] super proud of both of them. They're two adult men that I'm just, I've loved being their dad.

[00:08:48] It's been hard at times, but super blessed. My dad's survival tip to quote Ronald Reagan,

[00:08:58] trust but verify. Hey, you know, you want to trust your kids. You want to believe in them.

[00:09:05] You want to believe the best. I mean, you've invested yourself into them. You want to be

[00:09:08] able to, man, I've done a good job and they're going to make great decisions. I trust you,

[00:09:13] but I'm a verify and the survival has been always having that healthy sense of skepticism

[00:09:19] about what they say, what they're telling me. I don't ever want to be caught by surprise or

[00:09:23] like, I can't believe you did or you said what? I trust them, but I'm going to verify.

[00:09:28] Just have that healthy sense of skepticism so you're not caught flat footed.

[00:09:32] That's great. I love that you and Denise are such intentional parents

[00:09:37] and really it seems like the two of you talk a lot, strategize a lot, think a lot about

[00:09:45] the next stage of your kids lives, how we're going to react, what we're going to do.

[00:09:51] And you guys kind of come together before the, whether it's emergency or question or

[00:09:58] proposal or whatever is coming. You guys are ready for it before it happens. I love that.

[00:10:03] I love that trust, but verify. And then the last man in the room with me as pastor,

[00:10:11] Matt Kailer and Matt's wife, Bree actually helped me put together a similar discussion

[00:10:18] for mothers and was part of that discussion a number of weeks ago here on the Jesus famous

[00:10:23] podcast. So if you're listening to this today and you're feeling like, man, I'm

[00:10:27] vibing with this and this is really helpful. I wish there was something for my bride

[00:10:33] for the mom of my kids. Then you can just go back in the archive and listen to that. But

[00:10:39] Matt, welcome and what's, what are your stats and what's one of your favorite dad's survival tips?

[00:10:46] Man, it's so good to be here. Nate, thank you. So we've got two boys,

[00:10:50] Canon, who at the time this is released is 10, which is crazy to think about. And crew is

[00:10:57] five. So we've got two boys kind of in that elementary age range. So to all the dads who

[00:11:04] are listening out there, we're right in that spot and a survival tip. You know, I read this and I

[00:11:09] thought, when do I feel like I'm needing to survive? And I think when the moment that made me think

[00:11:18] is when I'm there with one of my boys or both of my boys and we're trying to do something

[00:11:25] and they're not really feeling it, right? Cause there's moments where we're trying to get our kids

[00:11:30] in the car. We're trying to get our kids to pay attention or, you know, these different kinds

[00:11:35] of things. And what do we do because I know I want to, you know, naturally get frustrated or lose

[00:11:41] my patience. And I think a survival tip honestly is just the power of laughter in a moment like

[00:11:48] that to just kind of break the tension, never underestimate the power of a good little tickle,

[00:11:54] right? Just kind of a tickle attack. Works better on my five year old than it does on my

[00:11:59] 10 year old right now. But honestly, I mean moments where you just pick them up, you just throw them

[00:12:04] up in the air almost just to like, let's just get out of this funk that we're in. So power of

[00:12:08] laughter. I think I try to use that one. Don't laugh at your kids. That one doesn't work as

[00:12:12] well. Yeah, you've tried that as well. I've tried that too. Yeah. I love that. That's

[00:12:17] so good. I think it speaks to the role of a dad as a leader. You know, you're setting

[00:12:23] the tone in your home. You're setting the environment whenever the family is together. And that

[00:12:29] doesn't mean that you have to be the dominant personality. Your wife might have more of a

[00:12:34] dominant personality than you do. She might be more effusive or praise more easily or

[00:12:40] be the funnier person, although both you and Brie are funny people. But what it does

[00:12:45] mean is that your kids are always looking at you, you know, wondering how's dad feeling?

[00:12:52] What's dad thinking? And so when you're in those tense moments and you bring the levity

[00:12:58] and you help them laugh, it's like you're serving them in a neat way. So I love that.

[00:13:04] All right. So we're going to get into our round table questions now that you guys have

[00:13:08] a little feel for each one of these men that are with me at the table today.

[00:13:14] And the first question I'm going to ask is what is one of your favorite things

[00:13:19] about being a dad? I like starting here because being a dad is a blessing. And

[00:13:27] I think sometimes when we're considering or consuming content on parenting as believers

[00:13:33] and Christians, sometimes we can lead with the pain, the agony, the sacrifice, the suffering.

[00:13:41] And of course those things lead to joy in our lives. They help shape us and mold us into

[00:13:47] the image of Christ. But it's a privilege to be a father. And so I thought it'd be great for us to

[00:13:53] start with something positive. What's one of your favorite things about being a dad? So rightly,

[00:13:57] I'll go to you first. I just, I have to say, I love the way you queued that up because

[00:14:02] I really think the same thing too. It's a real privilege being a dad. And yes, there's

[00:14:07] hard moments. Things change so much when you become a dad than when you're married or

[00:14:14] even when you're single. And things change, but change doesn't mean bad. It just means different

[00:14:20] adapting and finding a new groove. And that's a good thing to be able to do. So I love being a dad.

[00:14:28] My girl is two and a half. She's pretty talkative, but she doesn't actually say like full on

[00:14:33] sentences. Like we're not having big conversations or anything right now. So I think for me,

[00:14:38] my favorite thing to do with her, my favorite thing about being a dad right now

[00:14:42] is just doing things with her. She's like my little buddy. I wake up with her in the morning and we

[00:14:46] make breakfast together. She always notes when she wakes up that she's going to get a little

[00:14:51] gummy vitamin, a hard boiled egg, an egg. She's going to butter her toast. I'm going to put

[00:14:56] a little bit of butter on her finger so she can eat it. And I'm going to put her on the counter

[00:15:01] and her PJs and we're just going to hang out, you know? Can I come over for breakfast?

[00:15:06] Yeah, whenever you want. I'll put some butter on your finger for you too.

[00:15:10] Thank you, Ryan. Is that a similar routine every morning?

[00:15:12] Every single morning. She loves it. She will never forget that man.

[00:15:16] Yeah, she just loves it. So that's my favorite thing about being a dad right now

[00:15:20] is just doing stuff with her, showing her how to be in the kitchen,

[00:15:24] how to do things around the house. I just love it. It's so fun.

[00:15:28] That's so great. I mean, I've seen Meadow in action talking and you say,

[00:15:35] they're not full sentences. I'm here to tell you bro, those for a two and a half year old

[00:15:40] those are full sentences. She's full on girl. Yeah, she's a little woman and she's going to be

[00:15:45] talking for her whole life. So that's great that you're laying that groundwork and just,

[00:15:50] I think to me that highlights the importance of dads. We got to enjoy our kids. Enjoy them.

[00:15:56] They're all different. You know, you might have a child that's got a learning disability.

[00:16:01] You've got kids that have different difficulties and challenging parts of their personalities.

[00:16:06] You've got kids that you can't relate to, you know, I was talking to a parent the other day

[00:16:10] where they're worrying a little bit. They're like, I'm not a sports person. My husband's not a sports

[00:16:15] person. I'm worried my boy is going to be a sports person. But she said, but we're down for it.

[00:16:21] If that's what happens, we will enjoy that with them. And I think that's so important and

[00:16:27] you're just laying that groundwork and it is never too late to start doing that to show

[00:16:34] interest in your kids to just sit with them, be in the room with them, be about what they're about.

[00:16:41] It means so much to them when you do that. So good job, Rye. You're laying a great foundation

[00:16:49] there with Meadow. Mike, what's one of your favorite things about being a dad?

[00:16:53] Well, I kind of have a two-part answer to that. I would say my number one favorite thing is at

[00:16:58] some point you realize when you're talking to one of your kids that you've made the

[00:17:03] transition from parent to friend that not only are they calling you to ask you for advice or your

[00:17:11] input or your feedback on a situation, they're just calling to talk to you and tell you what's

[00:17:16] going on in their lives. Just like a friend. It's so refreshing just to be a part of their

[00:17:20] lives and know that yeah, they still want answers to questions, but you're just a part of

[00:17:28] their lives. They choose to be your friend. They want to be a part of your life and they want to

[00:17:32] share things with you and it's so much fun. I called my daughter the other day and she was out at the

[00:17:37] pool. They were playing pickleball. They were watching the girls swim and it's just like,

[00:17:41] this is just nice just to have a conversation with somebody that's like a friend that,

[00:17:47] you know, is your child you raised her? But now the relationship is,

[00:17:52] you're always going to be the parent, but now you just have a whole new level

[00:17:55] of relationship and it's so enjoyable to be at that level with your kids.

[00:17:59] And I would say number two, which should probably be number one is grandkids.

[00:18:04] That is like so good. I get in trouble all the time. A few years ago, I took my two oldest to

[00:18:13] hometown buffet and I sent their mom a picture of their seventh ICs that they were having

[00:18:20] and then I made the mistake of sending her a picture of the eighth we got on the at seven,

[00:18:26] loving on the way home. And then later she sent me a picture of some dishes that they broke because

[00:18:30] they were running around going crazy and just never again, dad, never again. Oh, I love it.

[00:18:36] Mike, you're doing it right. Yeah. Fill them full of sugar and send them home.

[00:18:40] That's so good. Yeah. You know, that's so encouraging to think about

[00:18:45] that as a goal for where you're trying to go towards with your children. I'll admit there are

[00:18:51] plenty of times where a lot of times a mom or a dad with maybe a preteen or teenage child will

[00:18:58] say something to me like my kid is just my best friend. And when they're in that stage of life,

[00:19:05] I just want to say, no, they don't need you to be their best friend. They need a mentor.

[00:19:11] They need a guide. They need a support system. They need leadership. They need someone to listen

[00:19:17] to them. They need a counselor, but they're not your best friend. You got to go to other people

[00:19:23] for that. But then to hear that, you know, as they then launch into adulthood and they

[00:19:29] settle into maturity, they don't need you in that same way anymore. And to hear a man saying,

[00:19:35] I shifted gears and now I just really love that part of my relationship with my kids where

[00:19:40] I can be friends with them. Man, that's powerful. I know a lot of dads don't make that transition.

[00:19:47] You see a lot of fathers, what you want is to be needed. I need my kids to need me. But what's

[00:19:56] going to happen when you've done your job and they don't need you no more? Can you enjoy

[00:20:01] them? And I hear you saying that Mike, I love that. Manny, what's one of your favorite

[00:20:07] things about being a dad? Well, as I've ever since God blessed me with children, I've never been one to

[00:20:15] hang on to them tightly. I hold onto them loosely open-handed knowing that they're a gift from God

[00:20:20] and that eventually, you know, I have to release them and all through all the stages

[00:20:25] from birth till I finally launched them. It was releasing, releasing, giving them more rope,

[00:20:30] giving them more rope until I finally took the rope and handed it to them. So now it's on you.

[00:20:35] So as they've grown through, there's different stages. This brought me great joy to release

[00:20:42] and not to long for, oh, I wish they were a baby and still hang on. So for me what brings me great joy

[00:20:47] was is to see them connect the dots as they progress through these different stages. Like I

[00:20:53] remember one of the things they were raised on with me as they were little kids telling them,

[00:20:58] hey man, you need to make a decision either you pay now and play later or you play now

[00:21:04] and then you're going to have to pay later. And to hear them repeating those things

[00:21:08] with their friends, you know, another one was my youngest son just told me this the other day,

[00:21:14] you know, as he was applying for work looking for jobs and goes in for a job interview. So

[00:21:19] one of the things I taught him when they were first looking for work and now that he's on

[00:21:23] his own looking for work on his own was, hey, don't go in desperate, you know, to a job.

[00:21:30] The fact that there's an opening lets you know that they need somebody, they need you. You need

[00:21:35] to convince them why you're the man for the job and that switch in their mind just produced so

[00:21:40] much more confidence in them and to see them make those make those connections and embrace some of

[00:21:46] those principles that I taught them and preparing them for adulthood as you've done. That's my

[00:21:51] favorite. That's my favorite part. So let me ask you as a follow up. I know you're

[00:21:57] bride Denise and she's a, she's a strong person. So maybe this isn't applicable, but I'm just curious,

[00:22:05] did you find over the years when those different moments came of releasing? Did God have you serving

[00:22:13] a role in your marriage where you were communicating to your bride, Hey, this is something we gotta

[00:22:20] do. Like was it easier and more natural for you or did you guys both jump into that

[00:22:26] together in tandem or not? I find in my marriage, you know, Christina being such a nurturer and as

[00:22:34] our kids are getting older and going off to college and all of that. I do feel a little bit that role

[00:22:40] sometimes like I need to paint a picture of what the future is going to look like and how our

[00:22:47] current decisions color the way that that future will look. Not that she's clinging on

[00:22:54] to them. She knows we got a release as well, but I feel sometimes that pain that's there for her a

[00:22:59] little more acutely than maybe it is for me. I know we've, I think you'd have to double back

[00:23:05] and verify with her before speaking, but if I remember correctly, we were both pretty much on

[00:23:10] the same page that we were raising men here, you know, and we were preparing them for life.

[00:23:16] I'd like to use the phrase, um, we want to raise marriageable men. Yes. Not necessarily

[00:23:22] that everything's about marriage, but that they possessed the qualities, the character qualities

[00:23:28] that the men of character that a woman would look and say, I want you. I want to be with you. I feel

[00:23:35] safe with you. I feel protected with you. They possessed those qualities. And so she was,

[00:23:40] she parented with the end in mind. So she was down for it. Yeah, I like it.

[00:23:47] Thank you, Manny. That was a good one. Matt, how about you? What's one of your favorite

[00:23:51] things about being a dad? Yeah, I'll manage so many. Honestly, you guys have some really good ones,

[00:23:57] but I think, you know, to be able to watch my boys and have them achieve, um,

[00:24:04] in areas of athletics that I wasn't, and then to be able to, I can't think of the word for

[00:24:11] vicariously is a good word. Yeah. Um, just kidding. No, I think my favorite thing about

[00:24:16] being a dad, honestly, um, it's just to hear them say my name. There's no, there's no other two

[00:24:23] humans in this world that can call me dad. There's just something so special about that.

[00:24:29] So, you know, one of my favorite moments you kind of describe Riley, you know, Meadow

[00:24:35] in the mornings, I love that time. I love when they crawl out of bed, hair is all messed up.

[00:24:41] They're still waking up and they just want it, you know, right now,

[00:24:44] you know, cannon comes out and he wants to chat and for crew, he wants to come out.

[00:24:49] He wants to snuggle. You know, those are just sweet times. So all of those, those special times,

[00:24:54] but then I think just doing life together, laughing together, playing catch together is just

[00:24:59] the best. I love, I love shaping our boys. Um, so I'm a big, I'm a big fan. Yeah. Just so many

[00:25:06] different things. I think peering into your family, I've seen that you guys love to create

[00:25:11] moments and experiences with your boys, you know, and our family is similar in that way. You know,

[00:25:16] we like having the vacation time together and those times where you just cut loose and relax

[00:25:24] and laugh. Yeah. There is nothing like that. You know, when, you just love that feeling

[00:25:29] as a dad where it's like every, it's like on greased tracks right now. Like everybody's good.

[00:25:35] The conversations are good. We're laughing. Our stomachs hurt because in our cheeks hurt

[00:25:40] because we're just having such a good time. Yeah, that's a sweet part of being a dad for sure.

[00:25:46] All right. Well now that we've talked about that, the next question I want to get into is

[00:25:51] what's difficult about being a dad and you know, how have you faced or overcome that difficulty?

[00:25:56] Obviously there's lots of things that are difficult. You know, it's a responsibility being

[00:26:02] the man of the household. It's a responsibility being the leader in your marriage is a responsibility

[00:26:09] being a provider and protector and defender and to be thinking through the future, you know,

[00:26:15] and sometimes that responsibility it can be overwhelming, you know, because the problems

[00:26:20] are complex. The issues are seemingly never ending. And of course in the times that we're living in

[00:26:26] now, there's so many things that we fear and that we're worried about and concerned about

[00:26:31] and those things can grate upon any parent, mother or father, almost to the point sometimes

[00:26:38] where you feel like, man, what did I do getting into this? This is such a huge responsibility.

[00:26:43] And I'm looking at our producer Dan right now who's just thinking about his future not yet having a

[00:26:48] kid, but he's thinking, oh man, what am I going to do in the future? God will be there with you,

[00:26:53] bro. But let me start with you, Ryan. What's difficult about being a dad and how have you

[00:27:00] faced or overcome that difficulty? Yeah, as a great question. I mean, like I mentioned earlier,

[00:27:05] being a dad is such a privilege, you know, but there's inevitably hard things and I have to be

[00:27:11] honest, like with me and my daughter, she's healthy. She's strong. There's nothing really to worry about

[00:27:18] with her. I feel very blessed. So my level of hardship has been very low on the scale of

[00:27:26] what could be. No, a lot of people who are probably listening to this have different

[00:27:31] issues with their kids or just with themselves. And so I don't have very many of those things to

[00:27:37] work through, but I am highly introverted. And so my rest time has been shot being a dad.

[00:27:47] I remember I used to stay up late, I watch movies and I'd wake up late and go rock climbing and

[00:27:53] go on day trips. And I can't remember the last time I did a day trip. It's like, what is that anymore?

[00:28:01] But we have fun. We go on trips and stuff. But I found that my recharge time looks so different

[00:28:09] now. And so I wake up a bit earlier than I ever thought I'd ever wake up. And I take naps now.

[00:28:16] The whole thing is just different now. I get fed in a different kind of way. I have to be very

[00:28:22] conscious about what I put into my body, into my mind, into my ears, in front of my eyes.

[00:28:28] Because it's all taking energy or giving energy. And so I've found that I've had to relearn

[00:28:34] how to rest. And I've had to really find my rest truly in Jesus and in my time with him and

[00:28:42] come to a deeper understanding of what it means to really rest in the Father, receive his love,

[00:28:47] receive his peace, walk in his way. It just has a whole different meaning now as a dad because I'm

[00:28:53] finding that you can kind of get through life not doing that in a lot of ways. But when you become

[00:28:59] a dad and you take on this unique burden and responsibility, you can't cut corners as much

[00:29:06] anymore. It's really important to follow Jesus and to come under that grace. And so

[00:29:13] that's been huge for me. But I've found that through all that transition that there's been

[00:29:17] a really great reward in it too. The Proverbs say that if you crack under pressure,

[00:29:23] you're not strong enough. And every time I read that, I'm like, oh my word, dude, I gotta get

[00:29:27] stronger. I gotta get stronger. I don't want to crack for my daughter, for my wife. And so

[00:29:33] these changes to my introverted nature, I feel like God has helped me become more

[00:29:39] disciplined through it. And that's been a real gift. So I feel like there's been an evolution

[00:29:45] that's happened, but it's come through some difficulty. Obviously, I think that's how it

[00:29:49] always works. But that's probably like the hardest thing for me. I love it, man. I'm so,

[00:29:53] I'm so glad that you opened up about that because it hits on a couple of levels. You

[00:29:58] know, I mean, one just opening up about the introversion thing, you know, because

[00:30:03] that's real for a lot of people. And the reality being that, man, you're just not going to have the

[00:30:09] same kind of time that you used to have. I'm similar to you in that way. And yeah, that when we started

[00:30:15] cranking out kids, that was the time in my life that I became a very early riser in the morning,

[00:30:20] partly because I just knew like, I do need time with the Lord. But partly I need time with

[00:30:26] the Lord alone by myself. This might be the only time that someone's not talking to me today.

[00:30:35] I think secondarily, men that are like that in women that are like that as well,

[00:30:41] it's helpful if you have a job that can be done at least somewhat in isolation. Because I know for

[00:30:48] me that saved my bacon more than once, you know, that okay, well, at least today, I'm going to

[00:30:53] have to go study the Bible for three hours by myself, you know, like that is restorative to a degree.

[00:31:00] But it hits on a deeper level in that what you're really saying is, you know, one of the hard things

[00:31:05] about being a dad is sanctification hurts sometimes. And that's what God is doing when

[00:31:12] he's working on that stuff in our nature and character. And you're just, you know, your

[00:31:19] thing that God is trying to sanctify you in in that category is having the ability to be stronger,

[00:31:25] not needing as much of that self restorative kind of time, not that that stuff is bad,

[00:31:32] but just it's a luxury that you can't have at all times. And so you're in that season as my life

[00:31:39] group would often say, really pouring out. So I love that Riley. Yeah, thanks for thanks for

[00:31:45] opening up about that one. Yeah, that was good. Pastor Mike, what's a what's a hard or difficult

[00:31:51] thing about being a dad and how have you faced or overcome that? So for me, I think I'm in a unique

[00:31:56] situation at this point in my life where all four of my kids have two kids. So we have eight

[00:32:02] grandkids, they're grown. I think for me now is just watching them do life praying they don't make

[00:32:11] any of the mistakes I made. Thank God they're beyond that kind of age of choice. But now as a

[00:32:18] parent, just to watch them go through life and pray that things are smooth, that there's no hardships

[00:32:25] in their life. You know, obviously, as parents, we all have the fear of losing one of our kids.

[00:32:33] I see it happen all the time with the kind of work that I do. I have called so many moms

[00:32:40] and said your your son has died. And it is the most painful phone call to make you can imagine.

[00:32:47] But to think to a parent to be on that end of a phone call. So I think for me,

[00:32:53] this point in my life is just seeing my kids be happy, see them live a good life and just pray

[00:33:00] to God that they get the call about me and it's not the other way around. And just

[00:33:06] having and hoping the best for them. You know, I didn't have an example of what it was like to

[00:33:12] be a parent. So it was a new thing for me. It was just make it up as I go. I blew the first half

[00:33:16] of my life in jail, living in my car homeless. But then to see God embrace me and bring me back

[00:33:25] into my family and to see that restored now I get to see their lives and their kids and be

[00:33:32] so blessed by what's going on in their life. So I would say my biggest fear is

[00:33:38] just praying and hoping that they just have great lives, that they follow Christ closely

[00:33:44] and that they just do what's right and what's good in God's eyes.

[00:33:50] You're so right the older they get the stakes are just higher and higher and higher with every

[00:33:56] decision that they make when they're three years old. If they decide to push a kid in the playground,

[00:34:03] it's a bad choice, but not necessarily yet life altering. But when you're 20 years old,

[00:34:09] man, you can make a decision that might inadvertently take someone else's life and it could change

[00:34:14] the trajectory of your life. So staying up at night worrying, oh Lord, please don't let them

[00:34:22] make a bad decision. Yeah, that's a challenge. But it sounds like your solution has been

[00:34:28] to commit to them in prayer, to commit to praying for them and then also to just be in contact with

[00:34:35] them, loving them in relationship with them. So far so good for you. Amen because that's really

[00:34:42] all we can do is commit them to Christ. I mean because as pastors that's what we tell other

[00:34:46] people, you know, because I always find it like if I'm struggling with something Michelle will

[00:34:52] always get me. She'll say well did you pray about it? I'm like darn it! Why do you always think of

[00:34:59] that? That's my job. But we really just need to commit our kids to Christ because he brought

[00:35:07] them to us. There is ultimately and so we just really need to commit them to prayer and just

[00:35:13] let him be in charge of the situation. And I think also it's great as a dad to remember how

[00:35:20] faithful God has been to you in your own life despite your terrible decisions at times. You

[00:35:26] know, I look back at my past in history and I think you know God was so sovereign. He was

[00:35:31] working in my life despite all the terrible choices I made. He's in control of their

[00:35:39] lives as well. I got to commit them to God that the Spirit of God would be released upon their

[00:35:45] lives to do things that I cannot do. So that's great Mike. Thank you for sharing that with us.

[00:35:51] Manny how about you? What's difficult about being a dad? How have you faced or overcome

[00:35:55] that reality? I recognize early on how little control I actually have especially as they continue

[00:36:05] age and get older. I think I figured that out when I was about 15 years old. I said,

[00:36:12] you know, I don't really have to do what I could do whatever I want. There might be some consequences

[00:36:19] but she can't stop me. And I think not only is that challenging or coming to that realization,

[00:36:27] wow they've figured out that they don't have to do what I tell them. That they're the

[00:36:32] free agents. Then it was difficult to know, it was so hard to know when do I stand firm,

[00:36:43] hold my ground, be hands-on and directive where I just got to put my shoulder down and say you're

[00:36:49] gonna come at me but you're just gonna bounce off because I got to win this one especially

[00:36:54] when they were teenagers. Versus discerning when it's those times and when it's,

[00:37:01] you know, I need to let them make this decision and deal with the consequences and not step into

[00:37:07] being a savior. So many times as parents I think that's because we fear what might,

[00:37:15] we don't correctly discern, is this one where I can need to let them suffer the consequences

[00:37:19] and not rescue them from everything? You know, I remember one time one of my boys was defying

[00:37:27] me. He wanted to go out somewhere, I was asking the parenting questions and he just, homeboy

[00:37:33] was stepping out. He was walking out of the house. He turned his back on me and began,

[00:37:38] I said okay this is one of those times that I need to stand firm so I grabbed him by the

[00:37:42] back of the shirt. He turned around and took a swing at me. Now he knows that I've been in

[00:37:47] martial arts and stuff. So for those of you who are listening to this who have perhaps maybe

[00:37:52] never met Manny, I'll just say he's not an unintimidating figure. He can hold his own.

[00:38:00] So anyway, I didn't want to hurt my son, you know, but I know how to take care of myself,

[00:38:04] how to defend myself and so I wrapped him up. You know, I stepped into the swing,

[00:38:09] the swing went around me, dropped him on the floor. We were, my wife and I were

[00:38:13] doing the middle of doing this painting project in the kitchen. There was paint flying all over

[00:38:16] the place. It was just messy, you know? And those was one of those times that I had to hold him down.

[00:38:25] God when do I have, when are those moments that I have to wrestle him down to the ground and

[00:38:29] the paint goals all over the place or when are those times that I just need to let him

[00:38:33] walk out? Yeah, that's tough. Are there any questions that you would ask or a grid that

[00:38:41] you would look through that would be helpful to you to deciding that or was it more gut level?

[00:38:49] I think this is one that I just, I'm sensing and I can't let this one go.

[00:38:55] It's a little bit of both. I think their stage of life and their age, you know,

[00:38:59] you know your children and Kate, you know, as their teenagers driving, for example,

[00:39:06] they don't understand the implications of they're still learning that. So you have to step in

[00:39:11] in those situations. They're a life, not just to them, but also to others. But you know,

[00:39:16] I think another one would be, you know, schoolwork. Oh, you don't want to do your homework. You don't

[00:39:20] want to study. Okay, go for it. Watch the consequences that come from that. You'll miss

[00:39:26] out on opportunities, you know, and they need to learn that somehow. And what a better place

[00:39:30] for them to learn that kind of then in your, in the safety of your home, because once they

[00:39:35] leave your home, the stakes are so much higher. Right? It sounds like so one thing you're

[00:39:39] thinking about is the ultimate outcome of this potential thing that I'm allowing to let that

[00:39:47] I'm letting go. Yes. And I think that goes for even sometimes the tendency of parents to meddle

[00:39:54] a little too much, you know, like for instance, if you continually think to yourself, I got to

[00:40:00] jump in and make sure that my kid does not fail this class over and over and over and over again.

[00:40:07] Well, that's going to backfire in the future because you're not going to be there at the job

[00:40:11] site someday when they're failing in that environment. So finding areas where you can say,

[00:40:18] you know, this is a safe space to let them just go to the nth degree of their decision-making

[00:40:24] process, reap the whirlwind so to speak and then learn from it while there's still time

[00:40:31] to correct. So yeah, that's great. All right, Pastor Matt, how about you? What is difficult

[00:40:36] about being a dad and how have you faced or overcome that difficulty? Yeah, that's a good

[00:40:43] question. Good job guys answering this one. I think, man, you know, so I've got our oldest

[00:40:50] who's entering his second decade of life. And I think I've just been thinking of the realization

[00:40:56] where my time is so limited. And I think if I had to say what's difficult for me in my stage

[00:41:03] of parenting, because I can relate probably to Riley, you know, I've been in that spot too.

[00:41:10] But where our boys are, you know, they're putting their own pants on, you know, everybody's kind

[00:41:16] of doing doing their thing for the most part, you know, they still think I'm funny like it's

[00:41:21] that kind of zone. I just love this time and I just know it's just going to go by so quick.

[00:41:27] And so I think there's an urgency that I'm feeling to have those moment create those experiences,

[00:41:36] to have those conversations that don't always happen on a face-to-face. Hey,

[00:41:40] Canon, let me I want to tell you some stuff. You know, it's like,

[00:41:43] it's the most random times where you see their heart open up and you're like, this is it,

[00:41:48] this is what I've been waiting for. And you drop, you drop that thing that you've been

[00:41:52] having on your heart to drop, but it had to happen through just like whether you're just

[00:41:57] chilling and they're there in a spot where they can receive it. I just want to, I just want to

[00:42:01] take advantage of the time. And so I think the difficulty of the limited time for me. Yes.

[00:42:08] So how do I overcome that? That's a hard one because we've only got 24 hours in a day.

[00:42:14] But I think what it's meant for me, and I know it's meant for a lot of dads is

[00:42:21] I've just had to say goodbye to things that I would like to do that right now I can't do.

[00:42:28] Right. I love, I love playing 18 holes of golf. You know, it's one of my favorite things to do,

[00:42:33] but it's also a good five, six hours mainly because I'm trying to find my ball most of

[00:42:38] the time. But, but I just know like these are moments that I don't think in 10 years I'm going to

[00:42:46] look back and go, man, I wish I'm so bummed I missed out on that round of golf. I'm so bummed

[00:42:51] I missed out on that, that game or that show. I'm going to go, man, I wish I would have had

[00:42:57] a little bit more time intentionally with my boys. So that's not to put a burden on anybody

[00:43:03] else. I'm just kind of feeling it right now. So wanting to create spaces where I can just be

[00:43:08] intentional. No, I get that you're, you're right in that stage where yeah, things start changing and

[00:43:14] the dynamic changes. The relationship can still be good, but man, yeah, in those early, late

[00:43:20] elementary school ages, it's just so much fun. There's challenges. They're developing like crazy,

[00:43:27] but it's so much fun. And yet you do, you feel that pressure and I think you know, you've encouraged

[00:43:34] guys in the direction of, hey, take a life inventory, ask the question, where is their wiggle room?

[00:43:41] Where are their sacrifices that I could make that I'm not yet making so that I can seize the day

[00:43:48] that's in front of me? I think I would add on to it that a way to really overcome that,

[00:43:54] that fear, that concern that time is limited is believe that you as a father have a superpower

[00:44:04] that God has given to you. And it's your voice in the lives of your children. There will be times

[00:44:10] where you're working really hard. There will be times where it's not the round of golf,

[00:44:16] but it's just the boss was like, look, you're needed late, you know, and you'll feel perhaps a

[00:44:25] guilt like man, my kid has been at school all day with his friends all day with his mom all day.

[00:44:31] What chance do I have to break through? Well, the reason you have a chance is because God has

[00:44:38] designed you as the father with like a megaphone of a voice that even a small little amount of contact

[00:44:48] can go a massive way in the life of your child. So my encouragement is even if the time that

[00:44:55] you have is really small, take advantage of it. Don't be ashamed of that. Don't back down,

[00:45:01] but seize even the little moments that you have. Yeah, that's because that is a challenge just

[00:45:07] knowing. I mean, you know, I'm watching my kids, they're all in their late teenage years and I've

[00:45:14] got one that's going to turn 20 this year. And yeah, you look back like, oh man, I wanted to have

[00:45:22] taught them this or I'd wanted to have taught them that. And I remember those ages that you're

[00:45:27] going through where you just feel like, man, there's this catalog. There's this curriculum.

[00:45:32] I want to take them through. There's like economics 101, there's relationships 105. There's, you know,

[00:45:40] like all these things I'm trying to communicate. They're in here. They're in my heart. They're

[00:45:45] in my mind. But where did the time go? But just trusting that what you have sewn when you do so,

[00:45:52] it will produce something powerful in the future. So take advantage of the voice

[00:45:57] that God has given to you guys. That was a great, that was a great round to go through.

[00:46:02] Okay, last question around the table before we then go around one last time and get a

[00:46:08] resource recommendation or book recommendation and a little exhortation from each one of you.

[00:46:14] The next question I want to do though is what do you, a gospel centered Jesus loving

[00:46:21] biblical dad want to be for your kids and what do you want to help them become? And the reason I

[00:46:29] ask it that way is because, you know, there's a lot of parenting podcasts out there, a lot of dad

[00:46:34] podcasts out there, a lot of dad conversations that are, you know, real general revelation in

[00:46:40] nature. Like these are good things for dads to do, but we're sitting here at this table,

[00:46:47] a group of men that have embraced the gospel and centered our lives around it, filtering our world

[00:46:55] through its grid. We love Jesus. We want him to be preeminent in our lives. We believe in Jesus

[00:47:02] famous and we want to be biblical. We want to have the Bible inform the way that we live our

[00:47:08] lives. So that might make us have a little bit different of an answer as to what we want

[00:47:14] to be as dads and what we want to have happen in the lives of our kids than maybe other fathers out

[00:47:21] there. So probably a lot of great answers, but I hope that these are more pointed in nature. So

[00:47:26] Riley going back to you as our first guy in the round table, what do you, a gospel centered Jesus

[00:47:33] loving biblical dad want to be for your kids and what do you want to help them become?

[00:47:38] Yeah, that's a huge question. Right? I think I was thinking about this. I was like, what do I want

[00:47:44] to be for Meadow? I want to be like so many things. But I think at the end of the day,

[00:47:51] if she went off to college and thought about like, what's like one word to describe dad, you know,

[00:47:56] I think I'd want to be worshipful. There's this book I'm reading called The Celebration

[00:48:00] of Discipline by Richard Foster. And he has this little, it's like one paragraph where he

[00:48:05] talks about holy leisure, modium sanctum. And the idea is that you can go through life and you're

[00:48:11] going through the difficulties of life, you know, hard work stuff, hard conversations. But at the

[00:48:17] drop of a pin, you can stop and look at a tree and just be like, man, God, you're so creative.

[00:48:22] Like how big you are to make this and how amazing you are, just have like these,

[00:48:27] these worshipful breaks. And it's almost like the like worship in your life

[00:48:32] is just the undercurrent of everything. It's like almost like right at the surface

[00:48:36] all the time, you know, not being weighed down heavy with just the weight of the world,

[00:48:41] but really lifted up with joy. A man who really embraces that God's strength is through joy and

[00:48:47] trust in him. And so I would love for Meadows to see like, oh yeah, dad was like a worshipful dude.

[00:48:54] Like he handled the hard stuff. He went through hard stuff. He chose hard things.

[00:48:59] But he worshiped God. He didn't let the pressures dictate his emotional state,

[00:49:05] his mental state, his purpose or his worship. He was just like,

[00:49:10] he rode with a different mindset, you know? And I would love for her to be able to see that and

[00:49:15] just to know that, okay, when I go through hard things, I know that God is still with me. Like

[00:49:21] when I was growing up, like some of you here, I grew up without a dad,

[00:49:25] but I had a really strong mom who really embodied that in a very strong way. And that's one of the

[00:49:31] things I always, like the picture I have in my brain, I think about my mom is her in her bed with

[00:49:35] her Bible and a cup of coffee. That's like the first thing I think about. I would just love

[00:49:40] for Meadow to have that kind of memory, you know? So I want her to see that from me and I want

[00:49:47] her to become a woman who is full of worship. Just loves God. Obviously, I think we all want

[00:49:53] that, but I want her to be protected from bitterness and resentment and a despair. I want her to be like,

[00:50:01] there's a future. God's with me. That word Emmanuel, I'm just all about that word Emmanuel,

[00:50:08] God is with us. So yeah, a worshipful person. Amen. Riley, I love that one because I think

[00:50:14] what as a believer, what we want to have happen for our kids is we want them

[00:50:20] to turn to God often, you know, repeatedly in and through life. And you're wanting to model that

[00:50:29] for her so that she sees this is the option that I should choose. I think an encouragement that I

[00:50:38] would give to guys that are out there on this front is that I think a lot of times it becomes

[00:50:46] easier to be worshipful in some of those external ways or even to talk about how you're

[00:50:53] feeling about God or what God is showing you. It becomes easier to do that with people that are a

[00:50:59] little further away from you, kind of at arm's length, whether it's friends and church or

[00:51:05] guys in your discipleship group or brothers that you know in Christ. And as your kids are

[00:51:11] growing up in your home, they know you. They know that you're not all worship, you know,

[00:51:17] that they can see your flaws, they can see your shortcomings. And because you're so familiar

[00:51:23] with each other, there can almost be a difficulty in opening up and saying, you know, God was

[00:51:28] showing me this or the Lord helped me see this deficiency in me or here's something beautiful

[00:51:36] that I love about God. You know, you could almost kind of envision the eye roll from Meadow, you know,

[00:51:43] with one more time where dad Riley is like, there's that tree Meadow look at it. It's beautiful.

[00:51:51] God is a creator and she's like, oh my dad is a millennial worship leader and he's proved it

[00:51:56] once again, you know, and instead just saying, I got to take those risks with my kids and I

[00:52:02] got to show them that part of me because it's good for them to see you with your Bible open. Those

[00:52:07] are some of my earliest memories of my parents as well. I'm really kind of modeled and fashioned for

[00:52:13] me of this is what it looks like to seek God. They got their Bibles open, they're spending

[00:52:17] time with the Lord first thing. It's a cornerstone of their lives. But then to take that next

[00:52:23] step too of opening up your heart to them and talking to them about what God means to you,

[00:52:28] that's good. That's really good. Pastor Mike, how about you? What are you a Gospel center Jesus

[00:52:33] loving biblical dad want to be for your kids and what do you want to help them become? Well,

[00:52:39] Riley ours are so much alike. Just kidding. For me, I mean it's profound because I think my really

[00:52:46] first introduction to Christ was I was in sixth grade. Our neighbors were Christian, Dennis and

[00:52:51] Jim Christian family, Christian mom, Christian dad, Boy Scout leader, perfect family really idolized

[00:52:58] their family. And we got invited to youth group. So we know we didn't go home and ask Dad so my

[00:53:06] brother and I went to youth group and we went in it was a little Christian church down the street

[00:53:10] and they were doing worship playing games and it felt really good. It was like fun. This is

[00:53:17] awesome. And then the pastor, youth pastor started speaking and we could hear the back door just

[00:53:24] creak open and everybody looked at my dad was standing there and look on his face. My brother

[00:53:29] I got up and walked out and he beat me to a absolute bloody pulp and told me that it was

[00:53:36] an embarrassment that his kids don't go to church that God isn't real. He wasn't my dad.

[00:53:42] I was pathetic and so that was kind of my first introduction to Christ and then my poor kids get

[00:53:51] the introduction of me being an addict and get to watch the whole transition. And so I think what

[00:53:57] I want more than anything is for my kids to know that I'm an absolute lover of Christ,

[00:54:02] that I completely follow him. I'm in love with him and that's how I live my life and

[00:54:07] that's how I do everything that I do. So I think that's super important that they see that in their

[00:54:13] dad because I never saw that in any of the male figures I had growing up in my life. It wasn't

[00:54:18] until I was an adult that I actually began to see that in people like Bill Holdridge, Skip Joanne's,

[00:54:25] Bob Stewart. It was foreign to me. I was like it didn't seem real that that was an actual

[00:54:32] possibility for an adult man to have a heart like that. So for me I want my kids to know that I'm an

[00:54:40] absolute follower of Christ. I love Christ and I will follow him my entire life and I think it's

[00:54:46] super important that they know that that too grounds and centers me. Amen. Amen. I love that

[00:54:51] Mike because our kids, they're going to learn from lots of other people. They're going to have

[00:54:57] lots of other models and people that they look up to. They're going to have people who disciple them

[00:55:04] and teach them things about the Christian faith. They're going to learn so much at the feet of

[00:55:11] others but I think what you're saying is, but I want in their home and in their lives, I want

[00:55:17] to be one of the biggest voices of what it looks like to be a Jesus person. Amen. Absolutely. I

[00:55:24] want to show that to them. So even if they're learning from other people, they're getting it from

[00:55:29] me as well. So I love that Mike and I praise God. I think your kids are watching that and seeing that

[00:55:35] in your adult life. So good job man. Amen. All right, Pastor Manny, how about you? What are

[00:55:41] you a gospel centered? Are you gospel centered? Yeah, I'm pretty sure you qualify. But how

[00:55:47] about you? Well, I did just have to in my own words echo what Pastor Mike said. I want to be

[00:55:52] that attractive, tangible example of how an imperfect Jesus follower follows Jesus

[00:55:59] imperfectly. And I don't want to be one that makes Jesus look like, man, I can't never do what dad

[00:56:06] did or do it how dad did it. He was just too good, unreachable. No, you can. It's possible

[00:56:12] to follow Jesus even if it's imperfect. And because of that ultimate I want for them to

[00:56:18] be lovers of Jesus. I would love for them to see for Jesus, the Bible, God, His Spirit to be the

[00:56:26] primary influencers of their lives. But I acknowledge that I don't have any control over that.

[00:56:34] They have to be the ones to choose in the same way that I did. I can only set the stage and

[00:56:40] create the environment, cultivate the soil of their lives to give them best shot that they

[00:56:46] would choose that. And so alongside of that, knowing that that's between them and God, that decision,

[00:56:56] what do I want them to become? I want them to be men of character who are responsible, respectful,

[00:57:01] full of integrity, hardworking. Yeah, that's what I want them to be. I love that. So to me,

[00:57:11] as I've watched you parent your boys, it seems to me that you've kind of concluded, okay,

[00:57:19] when Christ is on the throne of your life, there's a certain brand of life and character that flows

[00:57:25] from that. In my home, I'm going to make sure that regardless of whether my boys decide that

[00:57:34] King Jesus is going to be the king of their lives or not, they're going to at least understand

[00:57:39] some of the ethics that flow from King Jesus. And I'm praying that the conversion or the

[00:57:47] experience has to happen in their hearts for him to be the king in their lives, that that occurs.

[00:57:52] Nailed it. I can't make that happen, but I darn well sure am going to make sure that this

[00:57:58] lower tier does occur. Those were the expectations set in my home. Yeah, I love that. So

[00:58:05] when you talk about setting the stage or the environment for that to occur, can you think of

[00:58:12] any of the kind of stage setting environmental things that were important to you? Yeah, I think one

[00:58:18] of the key things that I remember and it actually has to do with one of the resources,

[00:58:24] grace based grace based parenting by Tim Kimmel. And I remember correctly is in this book that

[00:58:30] one of the concepts he suggested was parents, everything that you do and say values, standards

[00:58:37] that you set in your home, it doesn't have to have a scripture, a chapter attached to it.

[00:58:42] Whenever you do that and you misinterpret, misuse the Bible to drive home your point,

[00:58:47] can turn into legalism. Your kids will reject that because they'll see right through it.

[00:58:52] You have life experience. You have sacred wisdom that's already given to you from God.

[00:58:57] It's okay for you to have these are my person. Here's what God's word says.

[00:59:02] That's one thing. But here are my convictions. Here's what it's going to be like in my home

[00:59:07] to distinguish between the two and say, this is why I'm telling you this. I'm not saying this

[00:59:11] because God said so. I'm saying this because here's what it's going to be like in my home.

[00:59:16] I'm the authority. I'm the dad. We're the parents. Here's what we think is wise.

[00:59:22] And so being able to distinguish that was one of the ways that we

[00:59:25] establish those boundaries and guidelines for them.

[00:59:31] Yeah. So there's the, because God says so categories and then there's the,

[00:59:35] because God put me here categories. Yeah. I like that. Good job, dad. All right, Matt.

[00:59:40] How about you? What do you, a gospel centered Jesus loving biblical dad want for your kids

[00:59:47] and what do you want to be for your kids? Man, well, the advantage of going last is I

[00:59:51] can just say, yeah, amen to all of these guys. So well, so well said. I don't know if I have a

[00:59:58] unique take on this besides what's been said, but you know, I think when I think of my boys

[01:00:04] and I think of what do I want them to see me as or who do I want to be for them?

[01:00:12] I want to be marked by love. I want them to be able to say whether they move on or

[01:00:19] or out. Man, dad, dad loved God deeply. He loved mom deeply and he loved us fiercely.

[01:00:30] And I think, you know, if, if the Christian life of Jesus is wanting to do anything in us,

[01:00:37] it's produce a life that is marked by love, you know, a love for God and a love for people.

[01:00:44] So as you know, one of our favorite books says we want to raise kids that love God with passion

[01:00:50] and love people on purpose. And I think that's that's just something I just am cognizant of.

[01:00:57] I want, I want them because I think there's going to come a time when this kind of gets into

[01:01:04] what I want to help them become. I want them to tap into the love of God. I want them

[01:01:09] to just get under that spout, man. And so that just flows because there's nothing greater.

[01:01:15] And when we embrace God's love, when that becomes so real to us,

[01:01:22] when not if God calls them to do something that they don't want to do,

[01:01:29] where's the motivation to do that? There's a lot of motivations that the world offers

[01:01:33] to not follow God's way in the way of Jesus. But I think ultimately it comes back to

[01:01:39] God's love is greater than any, anything else. So, so I want to, I want to be a man who's

[01:01:45] marked by that, that kind of love and that, um, that invites them to enjoy that kind of love too.

[01:01:52] That is so good. Yeah. I mean, it's when you're, you know, in the throes of raising kids,

[01:02:00] it's so easy to just want a quick behavioral modification, you know, like, and sometimes,

[01:02:07] you know, that's our role. We need a, there's a corrective, you know, my wife and I used to

[01:02:12] talk about the preciousness of others. Like this fit you're throwing right now. Well, we love

[01:02:17] the other people in this room too. So we consider the preciousness of others. So you're getting

[01:02:22] a discipline right now, but ultimately at the end of the day that they would know God, love God,

[01:02:30] respond to God's love. And I love that, but what you're trying to model for them about

[01:02:37] not just being a God lover, but loving others too. You know, that's, I've watched my wife be,

[01:02:44] you know, fixate on that with all three of our girls that life is not about you. The world

[01:02:51] is not about you. There are others that God has put us here on earth to serve and to take care of and

[01:02:58] minister to, and to even at an early age, she'd start roping them in, you know, and I think I was

[01:03:03] even maybe a little allergic to it. Like, Oh, I don't want them to get burned out on service and

[01:03:10] church and think that this is like a mandatory thing. But she kind of just acted like you're

[01:03:16] in our house, you're going to help serve our church. You're going to help in the kids

[01:03:19] ministry at an early age. You're going to be doing stuff. And I've watched and seen how that has developed

[01:03:27] into an others centeredness in their lives because she had that as a value. Yes, we're going to love

[01:03:34] God, but the outflow of that is we're going to love other people as well. So great answers,

[01:03:40] you guys. And I think, you know, obviously we framed the question in a very specific way,

[01:03:46] but I just think it's good for us to just pause and step back for a second as fathers and just

[01:03:52] think about what is most important about what our kids become. You know, I don't know where you as

[01:03:59] a listener are listening from or what kind of culture you're in, but here on the Monterey

[01:04:04] Peninsula where we're at is very success oriented culture, a wealth oriented culture,

[01:04:12] an education oriented culture. And none of those things are wrong or bad in and of themselves.

[01:04:19] But I think what we're saying is there's an area of life that supersedes all of that. We want mostly

[01:04:29] for our kids to love and know God and then respond to him. And if that leads to tons of

[01:04:34] education, great. If it leads to a big income, great. They're going to help pay off our

[01:04:40] mortgages and help us with retirement. If it leads to those types of things, wonderful.

[01:04:46] But that's not the main goal. That's not the first place thing. And I think a lot of

[01:04:52] believing parents need to get that order corrected in their mentality of what they're

[01:04:58] mostly shooting for in the lives of their kids. I think for a lot of people at success,

[01:05:04] first character, second and then devotion to Christ last. We want devotion to Jesus number one

[01:05:11] character that flows from that. And we believe that success will come when those things are

[01:05:16] happening in a person's life. So that's what I'm hearing from a lot of you guys at this table.

[01:05:22] Guys, thank you so much for talking about being a dad. And if you're listening right now

[01:05:27] and you've hung with us this long, God bless you, you get a gold star.

[01:05:32] And we're going to close out with one little rapid fire round where I'm going to have

[01:05:37] the each dad at the table name a book or resource that they recommend to you. And we'll put a link

[01:05:45] to these resources in the show notes. So you don't have to pull over where if you're driving

[01:05:51] on the road, you could just look in your podcast app later and then one last little

[01:05:55] exhortation to encourage all of you. So Riley, we'll start with you.

[01:06:01] Yeah, I would say for my resources, obviously so many good books to read and podcast to listen to.

[01:06:06] I think one that's just on my heart to share is this book called Emotionally Healthy Spirituality.

[01:06:11] I heard somebody say recently that the world's not looking for more people who are talented,

[01:06:15] but for people who are more deep. And it's really true. I think our kids,

[01:06:19] whether they know how to articulate or not would like to see us become a deeper

[01:06:26] man of emotional, mental, spiritual health. And so this book isn't like the end all be all obviously,

[01:06:32] but it gets you starting to think about questions that maybe you wouldn't normally ask

[01:06:36] with your dude friends, you know, so a great book and I just believe that every man does

[01:06:42] have true depth to them. God has made you an emotional man. He's given you thoughts,

[01:06:48] he's given you desires, plans and purposes. He's begun it. He's working in you.

[01:06:56] There's there's new territory to gain. So I'm trying to say so if you're feeling like,

[01:07:00] gosh, I don't know how articulate all those emotional kind of things.

[01:07:04] That's okay. God is working that out in you and your kids will be

[01:07:09] so thankful as you work that out in community. And my last thing is, I guess just two quick things.

[01:07:17] One is if you're a man and you're, you're in your marriage, you have kids and you're struggling with

[01:07:23] pornography or are just your mind is just captured by sexuality in a way that is perverted.

[01:07:30] I just want you to know you're not alone in that there are other men who experience that

[01:07:34] as well. I would encourage you to get into a small group with other men at a church if you're a part

[01:07:41] of Calvary, there's great men's groups here. Don't go through that alone is deteriorating your marriage

[01:07:47] whether you know it or not. Please find some people to talk to and find some victory in it.

[01:07:54] Jesus wants to help you overcome that you can be rescued from it. So I just want to say that

[01:07:59] and last thing totally just left turn it just enjoy your kids. And I know I'm a young dad,

[01:08:07] I don't have much experience at all but what I'm hearing from all you guys and what I've

[01:08:10] experienced in my life is that being a dad is so rich when you truly do enjoy your kids.

[01:08:17] You look at them in the eyes, you talk to them, you listen, you don't just shume away but

[01:08:23] you embrace them give them hugs and I wrestle them and just have some fun. So

[01:08:27] enjoy your kids, protect your mind and go a bit deeper than you think that you might want to go.

[01:08:33] Thanks so much Riley. That's a great one and I'll just put in a special request because

[01:08:38] I recently noticed my wife she had a real big week. She was busy, some pressures and stresses

[01:08:46] that were weighing on her a little bit. She was just navigating all of it and then

[01:08:50] she got to watch Meadow your daughter for about two hours and I saw her countenance change and

[01:08:57] her spirit lift and I just said to her later I said you need like an appointment with Meadow

[01:09:02] once a week where you just hang out with her because it just makes you feel so good. So please

[01:09:07] can you bring Meadow over a little bit more often? Yeah, baby girls they're medicinal.

[01:09:13] All right Pastor Mike how about you what's your resource recommendation and final exhortation?

[01:09:18] To me this is pretty funny. I've been waiting probably since 2003 to be able to answer this.

[01:09:25] I had a conversation with you in 2003 I think you remember I was a new new believer

[01:09:32] probably weeks into belief and I asked Pastor Nate I said hey can you recommend a book

[01:09:39] that explains the Bible? He said well that would be the Bible. I said no no no no no no no

[01:09:45] no. I want you to recommend a book to teach me about the Bible and he would not let it go.

[01:09:51] It was the Bible to buy. I was really super frustrated with him walked away you know whatever

[01:09:56] under my breath but as I've grown and as a believer and when we were I was thinking

[01:10:03] about this question had a best answer it for me my character was so broken I did not need

[01:10:11] someone's someone to interpret the Bible and come up with something clever I need to look at

[01:10:18] my character reflected in the characters of the Bible whether it's the life of David or Solomon

[01:10:26] or the wisdom of Proverbs because I needed to go to the source and find out where my character

[01:10:31] is wrong because I didn't have character I did I had no value I had no morals I I was a yes

[01:10:40] man I would say whatever you want to do whatever you wanted I had no built in Mike character I

[01:10:46] didn't know who I was as a man especially who I was as a man in Christ so for me when I started

[01:10:54] thinking about those questions I had to just start going through the Bible and what characters do

[01:10:59] these men have that are honoring God? I mean we look at David all the things that he went

[01:11:04] through and it says that you know Dave was a man after God's own heart and we can start

[01:11:08] modeling some of those characters in our own life and get to the root of what's going on and for me

[01:11:15] it was it was just no character no moral fiber nothing and actually starting to build character

[01:11:22] based on things that I'm reading in the Bible not someone's opinion on what's in the Bible so

[01:11:28] for me because of how far gone I was I had to go back to the Bible it you know I still

[01:11:35] laugh when I think about it because people ask me all the time the same question that I asked

[01:11:40] Nate in 2003 they walk away as frustrated as I did and then I get to chuck on when I see them

[01:11:47] carrying a Bible reading their Bible and beginning to understand that's where really

[01:11:53] when all is said and done when you look on Amazon there's thousands and thousands and thousands

[01:11:57] and thousands and thousands of self-help books even so many of them they're Christian based on

[01:12:02] the Bible so I'm going to say if you really want to examine your character and who you are in Christ

[01:12:10] as a man or as a parent go back and read scripture and find out how to maybe reevaluate

[01:12:17] your life or reexamine your character and begin to build that into who you are so for me it's

[01:12:22] going to be the Bible and I love that Mike that's a great resource we'll put that link in

[01:12:29] the show notes Amazon link get a Bible read the Bible you know I a phrase I've been thinking about

[01:12:38] recently is you don't want people to conclude that there is a canon inside the canon and what

[01:12:48] is meant by that is as Christians we believe that Genesis to Revelation is inspired by God

[01:12:56] but a lot of times the way we handle our pulpits or the way that we handle the books that we write

[01:13:01] it communicates that well actually there's a special part inside the Bible that is the real

[01:13:08] canon these are the things or verses or concepts that as long as you know those you're good

[01:13:14] to go but to be a man of the word and to get into it and really realize that you know all

[01:13:21] of it is it's all saying the same thing in different ways it's pointing me to the same

[01:13:25] truths over and over again what a blessing so thanks for that Mike I probably had not read

[01:13:33] very many books when I was 25 years old to be able to give you a book so I just knew the Bible

[01:13:38] so you're just blowing me up right I'm really glad that that answer has gotten so much traction

[01:13:42] over the years Manny how about you last resource and exhortation yeah I already

[01:13:48] answered my resource question it was grace-based parenting by Tim Kimmel so I'll jump right into

[01:13:54] my exhortation dad's you matter your presence your voice your perspective matters no matter what

[01:14:02] society is telling you with a modern feminist movement you matter you have a place of course

[01:14:09] you won't do it perfectly nobody does we there's only one perfect father and that's God

[01:14:15] so don't use that as an excuse to check out your kids need to see how an imperfect father fathers

[01:14:22] they need to see you do it imperfectly you are that tangible example of Jesus that inspires and say

[01:14:28] hey I can do that too so learn grow read listen ask questions you know what receive God's grace

[01:14:36] for yourself of course you're going to make you mistakes and when you make a mistake when

[01:14:40] you miss handle situation continue to be an example of how a man handles mistakes humility be an

[01:14:46] example of humility be an example of honesty repent say I'm sorry that's my exhortation man I feel like

[01:14:54] we all need to have that audio clip as our alarm clock in the morning just to listen to Manny pump

[01:15:01] us up on our role it's just so true man yeah everything in culture is just saying men don't

[01:15:07] matter dads don't matter you're actually a problem and so to hear no I do matter not in some egotistical

[01:15:16] sadistic way I matter because I believe there's a God who exists who made us male and female and

[01:15:24] he put me in this family unit for a reason man that's that's good thank you for that word

[01:15:30] that was good all right pastor Matt how about you resource and exhortation well you know I love

[01:15:36] resources so well you could do too if you want to because man he put his in earlier so he did

[01:15:43] like said the Bible which is good so anything that I'm going to say is going to fall short right

[01:15:48] yeah I think in terms of dad good books on being a dad we kind of mentioned Dear New Dad shout out

[01:15:56] Pastor Nate wrote a book thank you for for new dads it's a great resource get it on Amazon

[01:16:01] really if you're a brand new dad entering into this you got to check that out super encouraging

[01:16:08] a book I just finished actually that I really I really liked it's called Habits of the Household

[01:16:13] and it's by Justin Early and the subtitle is Practicing the Story of God in Everyday Family

[01:16:19] Rhythms and I feel like he just did a really good job of saying hey here's here's what

[01:16:26] a day looks like and here is how you can take the moments the time the milestones of life that happen

[01:16:35] in each and every day and capitalize on them and build on them to develop habits that over time

[01:16:42] you're going to see building the things into your kids lives that you want to build and so

[01:16:48] super practical there's different chapters on walking different chapters on meal times discipline

[01:16:56] screen time family devotions it's super practical but I just really enjoyed it I thought it was a

[01:17:01] really inspiring read speaking of an inspiring read my second one intentional father by John Tyson

[01:17:06] it's one of those that you're just going to read it and feel like a terrible dad compared to him

[01:17:12] so just know that heading into it you don't have to be a John Tyson but but what he does

[01:17:17] is he lays out pretty much a blueprint for discipling your particularly your young

[01:17:23] boy in the teen years and I just appreciate a guy who says hey go after it like here's what you can do

[01:17:31] you have this time and so he did that with his son and he's developed a program called the primal

[01:17:37] path that you can check out as well but I think those those kind of resources inspire me as much

[01:17:43] as we're going to fall short and your your story your season of life might look different

[01:17:48] I think it's good to see who has come before us and I think what I would say for dads

[01:17:54] guys we get we get an opportunity to do something that is such an incredible privilege

[01:18:03] and such a beautiful responsibility and that's to shape the lives of humans so whether it's one

[01:18:11] kid or several kids my encouragement to you is don't don't wing it this is not a time to wing it

[01:18:21] there's a there's a lot of things as as men I think we probably wing whether it's in work you know or

[01:18:27] I think even in relationships we're still trying to figure things out but I think I'm just passionate

[01:18:32] about there's a community of men that I have you know around this table that I have learned

[01:18:39] so much from there are resources that are so good you have God's spirit living inside of you

[01:18:46] I just feel like we live in a day and age we don't have the kind of excuses to say well I didn't

[01:18:51] it wasn't equipped it's like man find some brothers find some guys some dads that you admire

[01:18:57] that you look at their kids and you go man they've done something right no no parent is

[01:19:01] perfect have coffee with them take them out to lunch and just be humble and admit I don't

[01:19:08] really know what the heck I'm doing and I need some help if that's you do that if you feel like

[01:19:13] you got it dialed and you're going my encouragement is keep on going just don't give up just it is

[01:19:19] worth it and man one day we're gonna get to that point we're gonna look back and

[01:19:23] we're gonna be having a lemonade with our wife and our kids are gonna be grown we're gonna be

[01:19:26] in the seasons where you know Mike and Manny are and hopefully we're saying we didn't do

[01:19:30] everything right we made a lot of mistakes but man we did our best and we love those kids

[01:19:35] fiercely so amen good word thank you guys so much for contributing today and if you're listening to

[01:19:43] this and it's been a blessing to you would you bless us by forwarding this on to another dad

[01:19:49] that you know and say happy father's day to them let him know that you see them

[01:19:54] and that you think this might be a blessing to them we just want to encourage some dads out

[01:19:59] there during this season